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Ding Liren
Ding Liren 
Photo by Emir Gamis 

Number of games in database: 1,657
Years covered: 2001 to 2024
Last FIDE rating: 2734 (2776 rapid, 2785 blitz)
Highest rating achieved in database: 2816
Overall record: +274 -95 =488 (60.4%)*
   * Overall winning percentage = (wins+draws/2) / total games in the database. 800 exhibition games, blitz/rapid, odds games, etc. are excluded from this statistic.

MOST PLAYED OPENINGS
With the White pieces:
 Queen's Gambit Declined (105) 
    D37 D38 D35 D39 D31
 King's Indian (80) 
    E60 E62 E94 E90 E97
 Slav (69) 
    D17 D12 D15 D16 D11
 English, 1 c4 e5 (58) 
    A20 A29 A28 A21 A22
 Grunfeld (53) 
    D70 D85 D78 D76 D90
 Catalan (51) 
    E06 E01 E04 E05 E03
With the Black pieces:
 Ruy Lopez (137) 
    C78 C84 C65 C77 C67
 King's Indian (78) 
    E60 E63 E94 E99 E81
 Queen's Pawn Game (57) 
    D02 E10 A45 E00 D04
 Sicilian (56) 
    B90 B42 B51 B22 B52
 Ruy Lopez, Closed (55) 
    C84 C89 C92 C91 C85
 Caro-Kann (46) 
    B12 B17 B18 B10 B13
Repertoire Explorer

NOTABLE GAMES: [what is this?]
   J Bai vs Ding Liren, 2017 0-1
   Ding Liren vs Aronian, 2013 1-0
   Kamsky vs Ding Liren, 2011 0-1
   Ding Liren vs H Ni, 2009 1-0
   Firouzja vs Ding Liren, 2022 1/2-1/2
   Ding Liren vs S Lu, 2012 1-0
   Ding Liren vs E Inarkiev, 2015 1-0
   Y Hou vs Ding Liren, 2009 0-1
   H Wang vs Ding Liren, 2010 0-1
   Carlsen vs Ding Liren, 2019 0-1

NOTABLE TOURNAMENTS: [what is this?]
   Chinese Championship (2009)
   Chinese Championship (2011)
   Chessable Masters (2022)
   World Cup (2019)
   World Junior Championship (2012)
   Chinese League (2011)
   Magnus Carlsen Invitational (2020)
   Chessable Masters (2020)
   Charity Cup (2022)
   Chinese Chess League (2016)
   Tata Steel Masters (2015)
   Chinese Chess League (2017)
   Legends of Chess (2020)
   Chinese Team Championship (2015)
   Istanbul Olympiad (2012)

GAME COLLECTIONS: [what is this?]
   2020 The Corona Beer & Black Bears Matter Mo Ode by fredthebear
   World Championship (2023): Nepo - Ding by 0ZeR0
   World Championship (2023): Nepo - Ding by plerranov
   FIDE World Cup 2019 by jcgandjc
   Ding Liren 1. d4 by OnlyYou

RECENT GAMES:
   🏆 Ding - Gukesh World Championship Match
   Ding Liren vs D Gukesh (Dec-12-24) 0-1
   D Gukesh vs Ding Liren (Dec-11-24) 1/2-1/2
   Ding Liren vs D Gukesh (Dec-09-24) 1-0
   D Gukesh vs Ding Liren (Dec-08-24) 1-0
   Ding Liren vs D Gukesh (Dec-07-24) 1/2-1/2

Search Sacrifice Explorer for Ding Liren
Search Google for Ding Liren
FIDE player card for Ding Liren

DING LIREN
(born Oct-24-1992, 32 years old) China
PRONUNCIATION:
[what is this?]

Grandmaster (2009), three-time Chinese Champion (2009, 2011 and 2012), World Champion (2023). He will defend his title against Dommaraju Gukesh beginning in a few days (November 25-December 13, 2024).

Championships

<Youth and Junior> Ding Liren was runner up on tiebreak to Nan Zhao at the 2004 World U12 Championship in Heraklio. He placed =3rd at the World Junior Championship (2012), half a point behind Richard Rapport and the ultimate winner, Alexander Ipatov.

<National> Ding Liren (丁立人) first competed in the Chinese Championship when he turned 13 in 2005, scoring 3.5/7. He competed again in the 2008 event before winning the Chinese Championship (2009), becoming the youngest player ever to win the Chinese national title, This result also gained Ding the final GM norm he needed to be awarded the GM title. In 2011, he won the national championship a second time, when he took out the Chinese Championship (2011) with a round to spare, and two points clear of the field. Ding completed a hat trick of championship wins in China when he won the Chinese Chess Championship (2012) outright with 8/11, a full point clear of outright second placed Yangyi Yu. He narrowly missed a fourth championship win in the Chinese Championship (2014) when he placed =1st alongside Yangyi Yu, but came second on tiebreak. A year later, Ding finished clear second, behind fellow wunderkind Wei Yi at the Chinese Championship (2015).

<Continental> Ding gained his first GM norm, a double norm, at the 8th Asian Continental Chess Championship (2009). Soon after winning the 2012 Chinese Championship, he placed equal fourth (sixth on tiebreak) at the Asian Continental Chess Championship (2012).

<World> In 2007, Ding scored 6.5/9 at Chinese Zonal 3.5, failing to qualify for the World Cup (2007) by the narrowest tiebreak. He subsequently qualified for the World Cup (2011) as nominee of the FIDE President, but lost the first round rapid game tiebreaker to Filipino prodigy, GM Wesley So, thereby exiting the competition. He qualified by rating for the World Cup (2015) in the first round he played and defeated Canadian Tomas Krnan in the opening round to advance to the second round where he defeated Ernesto Inarkiev. In the third round he overcame Gadir Guseinov to win through to the Round of Sixteen where he lost to compatriot wunderkind Wei Yi to exit the event.

Ding finished second to Ian Nepomniachtchi in the World Championship Candidates (2022). After world champion Magnus Carlsen announced that he would not defend his title, Ding and Nepomniachtchi met for the title in the Nepomniachtchi - Ding World Championship Match (2023). Ding won in tiebreaks to become world champion.

Standard Tournaments

In August-September 2010, he was =3rd at the Florencio Campomanes Memorial Tournament in the Philippines, half a point behind the joint winners Le Quang Liem and Jun Zhao. In October 2011, he placed =4th with 6.5/9, a half point behind the three joint leaders, Jianchao Zhou, Truong Son Nguyen and at the 1st Qinhuangdao Open Chess Tournament. There followed =3rd behind Hua Ni and Xiangzhi Bu in the 3rd Hainan Danzhou Super Grand Master Chess Tournament held in June 2012 and =2nd (3rd on tiebreak), half a point behind the winner Maxime Vachier-Lagrave, at the SPICE Cup (2012).

In February 2013, Ding placed =4th with 7.5/10, half a point behind the three co-leaders at the Reykjavik Open (2013). In April 2013, he was invited to the category 20 Alekhine Memorial (2013) his 3.5/9 was near the bottom of the field, but against that it was close to a par for rating performance, and includes a brilliancy against the eventual winner of the event, Levon Aronian. (1) In May 2013, Ding Liren won the Hainan Danzhou GM (2013), a category 15 event, outright with 7/9. In July-August 2013, he came =2nd (3rd on tiebreak) at the category 19 Biel (2013) tournament. He placed =3rd at the Cappelle-la-Grande Open (2014), equal first at the Hainan Danzhou GM (2014) and 5th at the Petrosian Memorial (2014).

Ding Liren's best result to date came at the Tata Steel Masters (2015) in January 2015, when he scored 8.5/13 to place =2nd alongside Anish Giri, Wesley So and Maxime Vachier-Lagrave, half a point behind the winner Magnus Carlsen. This result pushed him into the world's top 20 and became the second best player in Asia, second only to Anand. A few months later in July 2015, he played in the category 17 Hainan Danzhou GM (2015), placing outright 3rd with 5.5/9 (+3 -1 =5), an absolutely rating-neutral result, behind the winner Yue Wang and runner-up Hua Ni. He was equal third at the quadrangular round robin event, Bilbao Masters (2015), staged in October 2015, drawing all his games with a performance rating slightly below actual rating. He reprised his result at Wijk aan Zee when he again placed equal second at the Tata Steel Masters (2016) behind Carlsen and alongside Fabiano Caruana. During this event, he momentarily overtook Anand as the top Asian player in the live ratings.

Team Events

<Olympiads> Ding played board 3 for China at the Istanbul Olympiad (2012) held in Istanbul in September 2012, narrowly missing both team and individual medals when he scored 7.5/10 with a TPR of 2764. He played board 2 for China at the Tromso Olympiad (2014), winning individual bronze and team gold.

<World Team Championships> Ding played for China at the World Team Championship (2011) as a reserve, helping his team to win silver. Playing board 2 for China in the World Team Championship (2013), he won team silver and individual bronze and won the team gold and individual silver (on board 2) at the World Team Championship (2015).

<Regional Team Championships> Winning the the 2012 Asian Team Championship Chinese Team Selection Tournament qualified Ding to play in the 17th Asian Team Championships held in Zaozhuang, China in May 2012. There he won team gold and individual silver playing board 4 for China. At the 18th Asian Team Championships held in 2014, he won team and individual gold (for board 1).

<Summit Friendlies> He played on the Chinese team that lost to Russia in the Russia - China (2009) summit event. A few years later Ding was a member of the Chinese team at the Russia - China (2012) summit, which was won by China in the classical section, although Russia won the overall event. In April 2015 he helped China defeat India in their summit match in Hyderabad. Ding was also a member of the Chinese team in the novel China - Russia Challenge (2015) event, which involves one member of each team playing one game at a time, with the winner of the game remaining to play opponents from the next team until he loses, at which time the new winner "defends the stage" against the next opponent(s) from the other team. In his match up against Sergey Karjakin, Ding drew the classical game and traded wins in the two blitz tiebreakers before bowing out in the Armageddon blitz game that Karjakin drew as Black. The second half of the event was completed at the end of 2015, and won by Russia.

<National Leagues> Ding Liren's first FIDE rated game was at the 2004 Chinese Team Championship, when he scored 1/4. He has played for the Zhejiang team in the Chinese League since at least 2008 inclusive. During this time, his team took the bronze in 2010 and he has played 134 games with a 67.9% result ( +65 =72 -17) overall. He won team bronze in 2010.

Ding Liren played for the T.S. Alyans team in the Turkish Superleague in 2014, his team placing 5th.

Rapid and Blitz

On 13 May 2012, Ding Liren played in the 11th Asian Blitz Championship and placed equal second with 7/9, half a point behind Wesley So. He participated in the IHMS Mind Games staged in Huai'an in China in 2016. The Mind Games consisted of men and women's groups each contesting rapid, blitz and Basque portions of the event. He won the Basque portion (two rapid games played at the same time against the opponent) of the event after scoring 4/7 in the IMSA Elite Mind Games (Rapid) (2016), a point from the lead, and 17.5/30 in the IMSA Elite Mind Games (Rapid) (2016), two points from the lead.

Match

Ding Liren won the Ding Liren - Gelfand (2015) match held in July 2015 by 3-1 (+2 =2). He was eliminated in the first round of the China Chess Kings (2015) by Shanglei Lu.

Ratings and Rankings

Ding Liren's initial rating was 2230 in January 2004. He rapidly rose in the ratings, crossing 2600 in November 2010 and 2700 in October 2012. He did not fall under these benchmarks at any time since. He was one of the world's top juniors ranking in the top 20 from January 2011 exiting in January 2013 when he was too old to be qualified as a Junior. His highest ranking was world's #3 Junior throughout the 2012 calendar year. He also entered the world top 100 in May 2011 and has remained in that elite group on continuous basis since then.

His highest rating and ranking to date occurred in June 2018 when his rating climbed to 2798, and his world ranking to #4.

References

Everipedia article: https://everipedia.org/wiki/Ding_Li... Wikipedia article: Ding Liren ; Live ratings: http://www.2700chess.com/;

(1) Ding Liren vs Aronian, 2013

Last updated: 2024-11-22 08:54:47

Try our new games table.

 page 1 of 67; games 1-25 of 1,657  PGN Download
Game  ResultMoves YearEvent/LocaleOpening
1. Ding Liren vs W Wu  0-1552001Chinese Team ChampionshipC67 Ruy Lopez
2. C Wang vs Ding Liren 1-0432001Chinese Team ChampionshipE86 King's Indian, Samisch, Orthodox, 7.Nge2 c6
3. Ding Liren vs Zhang Jianhua 1-0592001Chinese Team ChampionshipC41 Philidor Defense
4. Tang Zijian vs Ding Liren 1-0352001Chinese Team ChampionshipD03 Torre Attack (Tartakower Variation)
5. Ding Liren vs Y Xu  ½-½612001Chinese Team ChampionshipB12 Caro-Kann Defense
6. Y Wen vs Ding Liren  1-0582001Chinese Team ChampionshipC00 French Defense
7. R Liu vs Ding Liren  ½-½742001Chinese Team ChampionshipC01 French, Exchange
8. Ding Liren vs Huang Yicheng 1-0352001Chinese Team ChampionshipC42 Petrov Defense
9. Ding Liren vs T Qiu 1-01082001Chinese Team ChampionshipB29 Sicilian, Nimzovich-Rubinstein
10. L Bregadze vs Ding Liren  0-1602002Wch U10E81 King's Indian, Samisch
11. Ding Liren vs So 1-0232004Wch U12A04 Reti Opening
12. Ding Liren vs S Sjugirov  1-0702004Wch U12A05 Reti Opening
13. H Ni vs Ding Liren  ½-½292008TCh-CHN AC10 French
14. Motylev vs Ding Liren  1-0462008TCh-CHN Torch Real Estate CupC10 French
15. J Zhou vs Ding Liren  ½-½6620098th Asian Continental Chess ChampionshipE87 King's Indian, Samisch, Orthodox
16. Ding Liren vs Negi  ½-½3020098th Asian Continental Chess ChampionshipD85 Grunfeld
17. Ding Liren vs E Ghaem Maghami  ½-½7320098th Asian Continental Chess ChampionshipE15 Queen's Indian
18. T S Nguyen vs Ding Liren  ½-½6520098th Asian Continental Chess ChampionshipC07 French, Tarrasch
19. Ding Liren vs H Abdullah 1-03420098th Asian Continental Chess ChampionshipE17 Queen's Indian
20. D Khamrakulov vs Ding Liren  0-16120098th Asian Continental Chess ChampionshipC00 French Defense
21. Ding Liren vs E Hossain 1-04320098th Asian Continental Chess ChampionshipD17 Queen's Gambit Declined Slav
22. Le Quang Liem vs Ding Liren  ½-½2020098th Asian Continental Chess ChampionshipA48 King's Indian
23. Sasikiran vs Ding Liren  1-04320098th Asian Continental Chess ChampionshipA48 King's Indian
24. Ding Liren vs A Filippov  ½-½6620098th Asian Continental Chess ChampionshipE11 Bogo-Indian Defense
25. Ding Liren vs A Gupta 0-15020098th Asian Continental Chess ChampionshipD02 Queen's Pawn Game
 page 1 of 67; games 1-25 of 1,657  PGN Download
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Kibitzer's Corner
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 29 OF 35 ·  Later Kibitzing>
May-03-23  fabelhaft: <<So until ding and Magnus play head to head in a match, no one can say magnus is better than ding >

I agree in a way>

I think that is making matches too much of the only way to compare players. One can say that Kasparov was better than Shirov or Grischuk without them ever playing a match.

<Carlsen won it when he 23, Ding is 30. To have any hope of emulating Carlsen, which is how he will be judged> etc

I think it wouldn’t be doing him any favours if he is judged in comparison with Carlsen. He had been the best player in the world for a long time before winning the title, with a long list of super tournament wins. Of his 25 latest super tournaments he had won 17 and finished second in 6. In the 15 following the World Championship he won 10 and finished second in 4.

But time will tell, Ding Liren has already had a later peak than Chinese players used to have. Bu Xiangzhi and Wei Yi were seen as future World Champions but kind of disappeared. Wang Yue was top ten at 23 but nowhere to be seen already at 30, Hou Yifan reached her peak rating around age 20 but is much lower nowadays when still in her 20s, Yu Yangyi is also still in his 20s but was much higher rated five years ago, Li Chao peaked in his 20s, etc

I think it’s much to ask of Ding to emulate Carlsen, he would do really well if he could score results like Anand and Kramnik scored as World Champions.

May-03-23
Premium Chessgames Member
  perfidious: Match play and tournament play are vastly different, same as classical and blitz.

<Geoff....Carlsen won it when he 23, Ding is 30. To have any hope of emulating Carlsen, which is how he will be judged>

Regrettably, there are those who will use this hopelessly flawed yardstick. No getting away from it. Against that standard, no-one is good enough.

May-03-23
Premium Chessgames Member
  Sally Simpson: Hi Saffina,

<The reason for that is that a player needs to hear the ball hit the other player's racket to know how the ball is it.>

Huh!, Next time I'm down watching the Orient I'll tell everyone to shut up, or get the man in the tall chair to do it, so the players can hear the ball.

And how about Lee Duck-hee - a professional tennis player since 2003. Born deaf. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lee_D...

I did not debate your other point because I was not sure if that not had already happened. (I do not follow tennis but something rung a bell.) also my eyes glazed over when I saw the word 'tennis'

Hi dempun,

I had in mind modern male players. I sat their glued to the screen like everyone else in the UK when McEnroe beat Borg. McEnroe's tantrums often featured on the news. Good fun.

Hi Overgod,

You are probably saying what more than a few are thinking, Ding was a bit lucky to be there, though others may not have put it as delicately as you did..

I agree, Carlsen quitting, Karjakin being a foolish were two things that had to fall into place. But Ding seized his chance, played some wonderful chess and him and Nepo put on a grand show.

May-03-23
Premium Chessgames Member
  Sally Simpson: Hi fabelhaft, And Perfidious,

It's only natural Ding's tenure will be judged against Carlsen's record. Carlsen was not a defeated champion and Ding follows him.

Best to look at it as a clean slate. A new era in chess.

Yes any comparison with Kramnik and Anand would be better. Carlsen's defending the title and tournament record is a very hard, nigh impossible act to follow. And Carlsen is not finished yet.

I think Ding's age and the following pack of bright young things will catch him up. That is a personal opinion not based on anything other than it's what I think will happen. It's a young man's sport at the top level.

But that will not be for some time yet, at least two years, if Ding does a Botvinnik and does not burn himself out entering a lot of tournaments he could well hold onto the title for a number of years.

May-03-23
Premium Chessgames Member
  fredthebear: Ding's win is Bobby Fischer HUGE in the East (in terms of impact on millions of people, certainly not in ability). https://asianews.network/ding-wins-...

China, yes China, is a world power in chess, and just about everything else of importance too, except pollution, civil rights, and "medical research."

Ding scraped by on the narrowest of margins. His reign will be one term, IMHO. His honesty and humbleness is refreshing. When was the last time we saw a champion who didn't gloat?

Who's gonna write the book? As long as it's not Rensch or Nakamura, I'm gonna read it!

Here's one from the way-back machine. It's another immortal pin game in a title tilt: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Am6...

May-03-23  fabelhaft: <I think Ding's age and the following pack of bright young things will catch him up. That is a personal opinion not based on anything other than it's what I think will happen>

Ding's peak rating was 5 years ago, when he was almost 30 Elo higher, and it's not certain he will improve on that. Caruana passed 2850 on the live rating list when he was 22 and is almost 90 Elo lower today. So was 65 Elo higher when he was 23 than he is today at 29. Giri passed 2800 when he was 20 but is 2769 at 29. MVL was 75 Elo higher seven years ago.

I think all top players care equally about playing well and scoring good results every time they participate, but it's not easy to consistently score top results and keep or improve a high rating.

May-03-23
Premium Chessgames Member
  Sally Simpson: HI fabelhaft,

By catch him up I mean nick his title, and then probably share it amongst themselves unless another Carlsen appears to hog it.

Your figures, (though I'm not a ratings is the absolute proof type. They are a rough guidline. ) back up what I'm thinking, and others are on the same track. I know from my own exeprience and others that age is a number that never goes down.

<Ding's peak rating was 5 years ago> He went on a bender that year. (2018) In March he was 2769 at the candidates. (his first tournament of the year) World Championship Candidates (2018) come November he was 2816 Shenzhen Masters (2018)

It may have been higher (or lower) if he did not break his hip playing about on a push bike and had to pull out of that tournament in Norway Norway Chess (2018).

May-03-23  Yuri Stremel: <it's a young man's sport at the top level>

Isn't that a little bit of a myth, though? Our top 10 have been consistently populated by GMs on their 30's or approaching their 30's. Firouzja is a once in a generation talent, an exception (it's a shame that he is not invested enough). Kasparov was #1 on 2000. Anand is still #9 after all this years. Kramnik, Aronian and Topalov all reached their peaks at "advanced" ages.

On the other hand, if you look at the prodigies, who is there on the top 20? Gukesh and Abdusatorov. Who else?

May-03-23  metatron2: <fabelhaft: Ding's peak rating was 5 years ago, when he was almost 30 Elo higher, and it's not certain he will improve on that>

Ding basically didn't play in elite tournaments almost 3 years during covid, and before that he was 2 years around the same level (with rating ranging between 2800-2816), and those 30 elo points gap that u mentioned, he just dropped them lately with his bad Tata Steel 2023 tourney.

So I don't see any sign for decline, but he was inactive so we can't really know.

I don't think that Ding will improve much, but I assume that with proper training, he can stay around the same level until his late 30s or even early 40s, but that might not be good enough, coz the youngsters are improving fast and also the engine/theory is getting more and more difficult to prepare.

May-03-23
Premium Chessgames Member
  perfidious: The peak age for a chess master has long been held to be 35; I am far from convinced of the following proposition:

<it's a young man's sport at the top level>

<Geoff....I know from my own (experience) and others that age is a number that never goes down....>

Father Time is one tough sumbitch.

May-03-23  Petrosianic: <perfidious>: <There are other posters who should perform the same disappearing act.>

True, that's the best thing about him. He doesn't beat the dead horse or throw good money after bad, he just fades into the woodwork, cursing his bad luck at being called out on whatever he's said, but confident that next time the exact same thing will get a different result.

May-03-23  metatron2: <perfidious: The peak age for a chess master has long been held to be 35>

They say that age dropped significantly, since strong engines and advanced PC based training techniques entered the chess scene, since the youngsters can now learn much faster than before, and also they are born into that new technology.

I'm not sure about that. I think that technology can only take you that far. But what do I know..

May-03-23
Premium Chessgames Member
  perfidious: I peaked twice: at 23 and 27.

Something of an anti-Korchnoi, don't you know.

May-03-23  SChesshevsky: <They say that age dropped significantly, since strong engines and advanced PC based training techniques entered the chess scene, since the youngsters can now learn much faster than before...>

This makes sense. Plus they can also now play online an old-time years worth of games in probably less than a month.

So maybe not surprising they can get to peak faster. But they might also be more likely to burn out faster too. Will probably see how all this plays out over the next five years or so as the generation shift rolls on.

May-03-23  stone free or die: <<Y Stremel> On the other hand, if you look at the prodigies, who is there on the top 20? Gukesh and Abdusatorov. Who else?>

Well, there's a few under-20's few at the top-20 door - Niemann, Erigaisi, even Keymer.

May-03-23
Premium Chessgames Member
  Sally Simpson: Hi perfidious, .

It's just a personal opinion, not a drastic prediction. There is a bunch of youngsters on the horizon and youngsters have no respect for their elders.

I hope I've guessed wrong (and a guess is all anybody can do) and Ding hangs around as the champ for a number of years. But I cannot see a 10 year run.

May-03-23
Premium Chessgames Member
  perfidious: <Geoff....There is a bunch of youngsters on the horizon and youngsters have no respect for their elders....>

This generation being no different than those which went before....

<I hope I've guessed wrong (and a guess is all anybody can do) and Ding hangs around as the champ for a number of years. But I cannot see a 10 year run.>

Absent Carlsen, Ding's reign has something of a Euwe-like feel, or even that of Botvinnik's, with the champion being primus inter pares.

May-03-23
Premium Chessgames Member
  Sally Simpson: Hi Perfidious,

Carlsen's generation are not getting any better, Nakamura, Giri and Caruana are now in the commentary box, that is where you go when you are on the down slide.

About 30 minutes ago I decided that anybody could be a chess commentator. Before the game you say how a player is going to win. When they lose you explain why they lost. Bingo! you are now a chess commentator.

May-03-23
Premium Chessgames Member
  plang: Some commentators are better than others. I thought Caruana did a very good job of explaining what was going on.
May-03-23
Premium Chessgames Member
  Sally Simpson: Hi Plang,

It was wee joke, but yes, Giri and Caruana were good, (I think I say somewhere on here I really enjoyed Fabio's trips up the garden path, ) This is the first time I'd given either of them my time. Usually watch a live game here, if I can, before that chessbomb, that's gone.

Decided I'd tune in to see what's what. (might as well, people kept posting in the thread here what was being said there.:)) I enjoyed it though during the adverts I switched off the sound and often left it off.

They might work well together. Don't know if the station could afford both of them at the same time.

May-04-23  stone free or die: <<plang> I thought Caruana did a very good job of explaining what was going on.>

When he wasn't being interrupted, that is.

May-04-23  metatron2: <perfidious: I peaked twice: at 23 and 27. Something of an anti-Korchnoi, don't you know>

Yeah sounds like real anti-Korchnoi, but I think that the peak age refers only to fully professional chess players, and I guess that you never considered yourself one..

<SChesshevsky: So maybe not surprising they can get to peak faster. But they might also be more likely to burn out faster too. Will probably see how all this plays out over the next five years or so as the generation shift rolls on>

They said that too in the past. That peak will be around age 25, and burn out/decline much quicker after that.

I think that burn out is individual. Some people can have lots of passion to their profession all their lives, and others lose interest quickly. I guess it comes down to how much one really loves chess..

May-04-23
Premium Chessgames Member
  perfidious: <metatron2>, while I was playing 150+ games a year in those days, I was never a professional.
May-04-23  Yuri Stremel: <sfod> I think Magsoodlhoo (is this how it is written?) Also belongs to your list. He is pretty young too. But the point stands. The overall age of the top players is much more spread than it is expected of a "youngster's game".

There is the theory that engines are making it easier for the prodigies to hit their peaks, but that is still to be reflected on reality.

On the other hand, one can say that engines are helping the top players to stay close to their peaks for much longer as well, selecting positions that fits better their styles and current forms, especially if they have money to hire teams to do all the research for them!

May-04-23  stone free or die: Hi <YS>.

<I think Magsoodlhoo (is this how it is written?) Also belongs to your list. He is pretty young too.>

OK, I could easily agree if we take the new generation as those born in 2000 and after, instead of the under-20 criterion I used.

For the record, FIDE uses <Maghsoodloo, Parham>.

https://ratings.fide.com/top.phtml?...

I appreciate your points, which I find interesting even if I may not agree with all the nuances.

I think older players tend to be forgotten due to familiarity - and the fact that their play has often plateaued or declined.

The new players generate a lot of excitement, as their ultimate level of play is still to be determined.

E.g. <Maghsoodloo>, who I regard as almost "fully seasoned", shows a linear rate of improvement in play (after a slight dip):

https://ratings.fide.com/id.phtml?e...

He's in one of the most difficult phases of improvement, like an aged whiskey (or wine) in the cask. The improvement is slow and very nuanced at that level, and every inch extremely hard won.

.

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