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  Jean Defuse: ...

The 'Neues Wiener Tagblatt' (17.03.1942, p. 6) has Thurmay<e>r as well as the game source (Badische Presse 18.4.1942, p. 6)



Premium Chessgames Member
  Stonehenge: It's Thurmayr here but I trust your sources more.

Besides, there's also a Siegfried Thurmayer from Mallersdorf, which is close to Landshut. Perhaps related?

Jul-04-21  Alan McGowan: In reply to <Jean Defuse> re Bogoljubow.

I am no expert, but Gaige in Chess Personalia gave Bogoljubow, Efim ....

Edward Winter uses that form in his index. I followed these experts.

Because he was associated with Germany for so many years, it seems appropriate to show the German version of his family name, rather than one of the variants.

Efim is a lot 'simpler' than Ewfim, but perhaps I am contradicting myself.

Jul-07-21  ADIN: so again.........

1927-1944: Vera Menchik (Russia/Czechoslovakia/England) 1950-1953: Lyudmila Rudenko (USSR)

vera menchik, even though dead should be champion from 1927 to 1950

and alexander alekhine, even though dead he is champion from: 1927 - 1948

Alexander Alekhine (1927 to 1935, and 1937 to 1946) ... Max Euwe (1935-1937) ...
Mikhail Botvinnik (1948)

max euwe like floyd patterson in boxing was gentleman in chess, he did not have to give him rematch right, he could have hold on to title, but chess players and all those greedy who make money, learn from him and paul morphy never thought of himself as pro chess player, he playe for glory and honor of chess!

fide morons listened to me: there will be 14 games in championship:

Premium Chessgames Member
  MissScarlett: Regarding the line-up in the Handicap tournament at <London (1862)> (, the full identity of the following players are unknown or uncertain...

S J Green ; Charles Pearson ; S Solomons ; A Cole ; <W Stockil> ;
E Harris ; G W R Wilson ; F E Lamb ; A Schroeder

Could <C Pearson> actually be Cyril Pearson? One candidate for <Wilson> is William John Wilson, another is James Wilson Rimington-Wilson

Premium Chessgames Member
  MissScarlett: G W R Wilson can be deleted. It was James Wilson Rimington-Wilson.
Premium Chessgames Member
  Stonehenge: He's gone. It's just a matter of merging the player files.
Jul-11-21  Caissanist: Kasparov played in the Croatia Grand Chess Tour event today under the Croatian flag. Would that mean that it is time to change the nationality in his bio to Croatian?
Premium Chessgames Member
  MissScarlett: G Kluger vs Nagy, 1942 and W A Foldeak vs F Nagy, 1942 are duplicates. I assume the Foldeak one is authentic.
Premium Chessgames Member
  MissScarlett: <Could <C Pearson> actually be Cyril Pearson?>

Scrub this one, too. <Charles Pearson> is specified in the list of Paulsen's blindfold opponents. I must have seen that before. It seems Cyril had already been appointed as a curate in Manchester earlier that year.

Jul-12-21  Z truth 000000001: <Caissanist> - it seems to be a curious case indeed...

1. His FIDE card has him still playing under the Russian federation:

2. Wiki of course notes him as being a Croatian citizen from 2014:

<Since 2014, he holds Croatian citizenship and owns a house in Makarska.>

though he apparently currently resides in NYC:

<Kasparov currently lives in New York City.[>

3. The following youtube video of his recent game with Anand actually show his flag as being 1/2 Croatian (left diagonal) and 1/2 Russian (right):


Jul-12-21  Alan McGowan: Part 1 of 2

Further to discussions about Paul and Hugo Bodenstein (thanks to all who contributed), I have been looking through the following sources: 1) Germany & Austria, Directories of Military and Marine Officers, 1600-191 and 2) Germany, Military and Marine Weekly Publications, 1816-1942.

It is usual for only the family name and rank to be given, except in special cases. A search for Hugo Bodenstein gave 0 results. A search for Paul Bodenstein gave 1 result.

This was a special case: two officers with the same name and rank serving in the same unit in the same city at the same time. Hauptmann Karl and Hauptmann Paul Bodenstein were serving with Ingenieur Inspektion 4 at Metz, 1907. (This relevant to 1905 and 1906 tournament reports.)

A service date for Paul was provided ? 14.9.00 ? the date of his promotion to Hauptmann. This piece of information, along with the detailed information from marriage and birth records ? rank, unit, base station, home address ?allowed for Paul Bodenstein?s military career to be tracked. I chose to begin in 1891, when he married (this is also relevant to a 1920 finding).

In 1891 Paul Bodenstein was a Leutnant in Pionier Bataillon 17, based in Stettin but with a Berlin home address.

In 1893 he was temporarily attached to Inspection of Military Telegraph, Berlin, as P.L. and Adj., and in 1894 Pr. Lt. Bodenstein was transferred to Ingenieur Inspektion 3.

An 1895 entry shows that he was stationed at Koeln, and he was still there in the 1896 and 1897 entries.

A relevant CG submission about this time was:

Jul-08-21 Chessist: Deutsche Schachzeitung, Nov. 1896, back cover: German Chess Federation membership in August 1896: II. Individual members ...
Bodenstein, Hugo, Prem.-Leutnant, Coeln, Member since 6/7. 96.

There was only one Prem. Leutnant Bodenstein in the Koeln unit at the time, Paul Bodenstein.

By 1898 Paul Bodenstein was a Prem. Leutnant with Pionier Bataillon 3 at Spandau, Berlin. He remained with this unit through 1899, by which time he is shown as Oblt (Oberleutnant).

Another relevant CG submission:

Jul-03-21 Chessist: Berger, Schach-Jahrbuch fuer 1899-1900, p. 108: "Bodenstein, Hugo, Oberleutnant im 3. Pionier-Bat. in Spandau. Einzelmitglied d. deutschen Schachbundes; H Barmen 95 II get., H Koeln 1898."

There was only one Oblt. Bodenstein in the unit at the time, and that was Paul (there was also a Hauptmann Bodenstein). Also, it has already been pointed out that reports on the Koeln 1898 congress showed P. Bodenstein (Berlin) as one of the entrants. His game against Exner at that event was published in several places and was used as part of the report on P. Bodenstein?s death in the Deutsche Schachblaetter 1934.

In 1900 Paul Bodenstein was promoted to Hauptmann and began serving with Pionier Bataillon 18 at Koenigsberg. He remained there through 1903.

In 1904 he was transferred to Ingenieur Inspektion 4, based at Metz. He remained there through 1908.

During that period there were reports of a chess tournament for the army in Vienna in 1905 that mentioned a Prussian Hauptmann H. Bodenstein. And the Deutsche Schachzeitung 1905, p127 referred to Hauptmann H. Bodenstein (Metz). During 1905 and 1906 there was only Hauptmann Bodenstein at Metz, and that was Paul

In 1908 Paul Bodenstein was transferred to the Ingenieur Komitee in Berlin. He remained in this post through 1910, during which time there are references to Hauptmann Bodenstein playing the Winter Tournaments of the Berliner Schachgesellschaft 1908/09 and 1909/10 (Deutsche Schachzeitung 1909, p88 and 1910, p218), and the Schachgesellschaft championship of 1910/11 (Neue Schlesische Zeitung, 14 Jan 1911).

Jul-12-21  Alan McGowan: Part 2 of 2

HAMBURG 1910?Hauptturnier
The history of the Berliner Schachgesellschaft 1827-1927 (p106) mentions some of their members who played at Hamburg 1910, including ?Bodenstein?.

The Deutsche Schachzeitung 1910 (p224) gives Bodenstein (Grunewald). The 1910 Berlin Address Book P239 of the surname section) shows Paul Bodenstein, hauptm. Mitglied i. Ingen. Komite, Schmargendf, Caspar Thei? Str 16 III (Post Grunewald). However, there is a return to confusion on p232 of the 1910 DSZ, in which the crosstable seems to show H. Bodenstein; and the Wiener Schachzeitung 1910, p338, states that H. Bodenstein (Spandau) was at Hamburg.

Serious consideration should be given to the possibility that games attributed to Hugo Bodenstein at this event were played by Paul Bodenstein.

In 1911 Bodenstein was promoted to Major and transferred to Ingenieur Inspektion 2. In 1917 he transferred to Ing. Offiz and in 1918, by now an Oberst (Colonel), he retired.

1900: I don?t have anything relevant in my library, but a Google Books search shows a few references to the Hoefer-P. Bodenstein game; played in January 1900 in the Berliner Schachgesellschaft. Paul Bodenstein was still in Berlin at this time, his promotion to Hauptmann being announced in the 26 May (extra edition) of the Milit?r Wochenblatt.

1920 BERLIN ? Hauptturnier
The tournament book for the German Chess Federation Congress shows Bodenstein (Freiburg) in a Hauptturnier.

The Berliner B?rsenzeitung of 31 January 1920, p6, column 5 discusses a company listed under number 3671. The partners include Elisabeth Bodenstein, born Felisch, then in Freiburg i. B. (im Breisgau). This was Paul Bodenstein?s wife, whom he married in 1891. It also states: Dem Paul Bodenstein in Freiburg i.B. ist Prokura erteilt. (Power of Attorney, I think.)

It appears, therefore, that Paul Bodenstein, normally resident in Berlin, was temporarily in Freiburg, helping his wife and other members of her family with a business they had inherited.

Therefore, the Brinckmann-Hugo Bodenstein game from this tournament seems to be wrongly attributed.

Paul Bodenstein continued to appear in Berliner Schachgesellschaft events right up to shortly before his death. He played in the Berlin Championship for 1922 and 1930, the 1924 Th?ringer Congress, and he won the 5th Brandenburg Congress in 1927.

He may not have been a master of the first rank, but he deserves to be properly acknowledged and his games to be properly attributed.

The mention of Hugo Bodenstein in the DSZ 1896 and the Berger Schachjahrbuch 1899-1900 seem to have been responsible for later references to ?H. Bodenstein?. After all, the DSZ, which said Hugo was the federation member, correctly gave the rank and Koeln base for Paul Bodenstein, and Berger, who wrongly said Hugo played at Koeln 1898, did correctly note the rank and military unit for Paul Bodenstein.

Jul-12-21  Chessist: I am impressed.
Premium Chessgames Member
  MissScarlett: So which games, if any, are, currently, wrongly attributed?
Jul-13-21  Chessist: All "Hugo" games.
Premium Chessgames Member
  MissScarlett: So there is no Hugo?
Premium Chessgames Member
  MissScarlett: <Miss Sally> at the ECF draws attention to the <Oxford Companion to Chess (1984, 1e)> at:

Uploaded back in 2017 by our friend <billwall>. Don't ask me if it's kosher.

Premium Chessgames Member
  Jean Defuse: ...

<MissScarlett> You're right - Walter Arpad Foldeak also known as <Khloyber> in various databases as Kluger?


Premium Chessgames Member
  MissScarlett: <He's gone. It's just a matter of merging the player files.>

How is that done, again?

Premium Chessgames Member
  Stonehenge: Say I want to keep Simon Alejandro Languidey and get rid of Simon Languidey.

Then I make a correction slip for the latter (This player is a duplicate of another player on file).

You'll only need the pid of the right player file, 159843 in this case.

Then you go to your editor page and find the correction slip.

Just enter 159843 where it says Player's PID and then merge the players.

Premium Chessgames Member


Did we change the plan on getting rid of patronymics? I notice in your example above you kept the name with the patronymic but deleted the name without the patronymic?

I recently got rid of two or three patronymics, thinking that was still our protocol?

I don't mind switching the protocol, but I had not noticed any change in the plan. At any rate, sorry to cause extra work for you if that's what happened.

I won't be altering any patronymics in names until I hear what the actual present plan is on that.

Premium Chessgames Member
  Stonehenge: I'm not sure if that's a patronymic. I thought they were just two forenames. At any rate his FIDE card says Simon Alejandro Languidey.

I got mad at you the other day because you deleted player files with a bio and possibly kibitzing.

In cases like that you delete the other player's page. If your not happy with the remaining player's name, then change it. But don't delete bios unless it's crap and you rewrite an other one. And don't delete player files that have kibitzing, unless it's crap.

Just yesterday I was fantasizing about merging Rogoff with NN and thus hopefully deleting all the kibitzing :)

But I'm afraid Susan would sue me over it.

Premium Chessgames Member


<In cases like that you delete the other player's page. If your not happy with the remaining player's name, then change it.>

Thank you for your patience and good information!

Along with the other instructions you gave in Biographer Bistro (kibitz #21952) , I now know how to do it without losing any information about the players.

Premium Chessgames Member
  mifralu: This game Dake vs A De Burca, 1935 is a duplicate of Dake vs T G Cranston, 1935
Cranston 0 - 1 Kupchik
De Burca 0 - 1 Dake gives Thomas George Cranston

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