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The World vs Gert Timmerman
C U R R E N T P O S I T I O N

Can a group of chess amateurs team up to beat a grandmaster? Find out in the Chessgames Challenge! You can vote for the move you think is best, and discuss the game with other members on this page.

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[G.J. Timmerman]

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GAME OVER: 1-0

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MOVES:
1.d4 f5 2.g3 Nf6 3.Bg2 g6 4.c4 Bg7 5.Nc3 O-O 6.Nf3 d6 7.O-O c6 8.Qb3 Na6 9.Rd1 Kh8 10.Qa3 Nc7 11.d5 Bd7 12.Rb1 a5 13.dxc6 bxc6 14.c5 Ne4 15.cxd6 exd6 16.Bf4 d5 17.Be5 Re8 18.Bxg7+ Kxg7 19.Rbc1 Qe7 20.Qxe7+ Rxe7 21.Na4 Nb5 22.Nb6 Ra6 23.Nxd7 Rxd7 24.Ne5 Rd6 25.f3 Nf6 26.a4 Nc7 27.Bf1 Re6 28.f4 Ne4 29.e3 Rb6 30.Bd3 Na6 31.b4 Nxb4 32.Bxe4 fxe4 33.Nd7 Rb7 34.Nc5 Ree7 35.Nxb7 Rxb7 36.g4 Rc7 37.Rc5 Ra7 38.h4 Ra6 39.Rcc1 Kf6 40.Rf1 Nd3 41.Rb1 h5 42.gxh5 gxh5 43.Rb8 c5 44.Rfb1 d4 45.Kf1 dxe3 46.Rf8+ Ke7 47.Rbb8 Rg6 48.Rbe8+ Kd6 49.Rxe4 Kd5 50.f5 Rg3 51.Rfe8 c4 52.f6 Rf3+ 53.Ke2 Rxf6 54.Kxe3 Rc6 55.Rd4+ Kc5 56.Rb8 Re6+ 57.Re4 Rxe4+ 58.Kxe4 Nf2+ 59.Kf3 Ng4 60.Rb5+ Kd4 61.Rxh5 c3 62.Ke2 1-0
GAME OVER thank you for playing	it is now 06:19:01
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< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 1733 OF 1784 · Later Kibitzing>
Jul-29-08		rinus: <g.mueller> <GJT - World, moves with Shredderbases> And now <without> Shredderbases, à Capablanca.

Jul-29-08		moronovich: Chess is the ultimate excuse for not dating Julia Roberts.

Jul-29-08		g.mueller: <kb2ct: <g.mueller: GJT - World, moves with Shredderbases Analysis by Deep Shredder 11 UCI:depth=22 2. (6.46): 61.Rxa5 c3 62.Ke2 Nf6 63.Rf5 Ne4> Günter, 63...Ne4 loses to 64. Rf4 and <<<65. RxN ??>>> tablebase win.> 61.Rxa5 c3 62.Ke2 Nf6 63.Rf5 Ne4 64. Rf4 Ke5! click for larger view Engine: Shredder 11 UCI 1. +6.03 65.Ke3 2. +4.51 65.Rf7 Nc5 3. +3.98 65.Kf3 Nd6 4. +3.95 65.Rf8 5. < +0.01 65.Rxe4+ ?? Kxe4 !! >

Jul-29-08		YouRang: <moronovich: Chess is the ultimate excuse for not dating Julia Roberts.> Yep. It's always worked for me.

Jul-29-08		devioustalfan: 60. ...K~ 61. Rxa5 promotion ASAP

Jul-29-08		MrSpock: <randzo: why is Timberman still playing???> As long as Black has his knight, White needs minimum one pawn to win. After a few strong moves the win of the world team should be definite.

Jul-29-08		g.mueller: click for larger view Analysis by HIARCS 11.2 SP: 1. (6.96): 61.Rxh5 Nh2+ 62.Kf4 c3 63.Rh8 c2 64.Rc8 Kd3 65.h5 Nf1 66.h6 Nd2 67.Rxc2 Kxc2 68.h7 Kd3 69.h8Q Nb3 70.Qd8+ Kc3 71.Qc8+ Kd3 2. (4.74): 61.Rxa5 Ne5+ 62.Ke2 Ke4 63.Kd2 Kd4 64.Kc2 Nd3 65.Rxh5

Jul-29-08		ganstaman: <kb2ct: <ganstaman: Entering the tablebase is the same thing as ending the game, in my eyes, so that's where I'd aim.> The tablebase wins are diffent number of moves to mate depebding on a number of factors. Sometimes for example a lone rook is faster than queen versus knight. Sometimes delaying tablebase entry speeds up the mate. Tablebases are no reason to stop thinking.> Once we enter tablebase territory, the outcome of the game is no longer in question. Nothing more can be gained by playing on because nothing more can be learned from the game (instead, go play with a tablebase to learn how the ending goes). Therefore, I think it is very unlikely that GMT will continue to play on once we are down to 6 pieces. This means that distance to mate would be useless. Also, once you reach a tablebase position, why would you continue thinking?

Jul-29-08		kb2ct: Günter, Rf4 is deeper than just a tablebase win. It drives the black king back, gets the a-pawn moving, wins the c-pawn while separating black's king from the passers. If Shredder doesn't evaluate this above +9.00, I would be surprised. :0) 61. Rxa5 c3 62. Ke2 Nf6 63. Rf5 Ne4 64. Rf4 Ke5 65. Ke3 Nc5 (65... c2 66. Rxe4+ Kd5 67. Kd2) 66. a5 Na6 67. Rc4 Kd6 68. Rxc3

Jul-29-08		ravel5184: <AngryAaron69> __\|__\|_X _O\|_O\|_X _X\|__\|_O If you play <Xa3>, I play <Ob3>. If not, I play <0a3> :)

Jul-29-08		g.mueller: click for larger view Analysis by Fritz 10: 61.Rxh5 c3 62.Ke2 Ne3 63.Rg5 Nf1 64.Rg4+ Kc5 65.Kd3 Nh2 66.Rf4 Kd6 67.h5 Ke5 68.h6 Kxf4 (5.84) Depth: 22/52 00:02:22 253mN, tb=100245 61.Rxh5 c3 62.Ke2 Ne3 63.Rg5 Nf1 64.Rg4+ Kc5 65.Kd3 c2 66.Rc4+ Kd6 67.Rxc2 Ng3 68.Rg2 Nf5 69.h5 Ke7 70.Rg5 Nd6 71.Rxa5 Kf6 (6.11) Depth: 23/49 00:04:28 481mN, tb=209519 <61.Rxh5> (6.39) Depth: 24/53 00:08:40 943mN, tb=473309 61.Rxh5 (6.68) Depth: 24/53 00:10:24 1131mN, tb=631814 61.Rxh5 (7.24) Depth: 24/53 00:11:53 1302mN, tb=795072 61.Rxh5 (7.52) Depth: 25/55 00:20:36 2297mN, tb=1365797 61.Rxh5 (7.80) Depth: 26/79 00:36:35 4104mN, tb=2553894 61.Rxh5 < (8.08) Depth: 26/79> 00:44:55 5064mN, tb=3619417

Jul-29-08		g.mueller: 1. d4 f5 2. g3 Nf6 3. Bg2 g6 4. c4 Bg7 5. Nc3 O-O 6. Nf3 d6 7. O-O c6 8. Qb3 Na6 9. Rd1 Kh8 10. Qa3 Nc7 11. d5 Bd7 12. Rb1 a5 13. dxc6 bxc6 14. c5 Ne4 15. cxd6 exd6 16. Bf4 d5 17. Be5 Re8 18. Bxg7+ Kxg7 19. Rbc1 Qe7 20. Qxe7+ Rxe7 21. Na4 Nb5 22. Nb6 Ra6 23. Nxd7 Rxd7 24. Ne5 Rd6 25. f3 Nf6 26. a4 Nc7 27. Bf1 Re6 28. f4 Ne4 29. e3 Rb6 30. Bd3 Na6 31. b4 Nxb4 32. Bxe4 fxe4 33. Nd7 Rb7 34. Nc5 Ree7 35. Nxb7 Rxb7 36. g4 Rc7 37. Rc5 Ra7 38. h4 Ra6 39. Rcc1 Kf6 40. Rf1 Nd3 41. Rb1 h5 42. gxh5 gxh5 43. Rb8 c5 44. Rfb1 d4 45. Kf1 dxe3 46. Rf8+ Ke7 47. Rbb8 Rg6 48. Rbe8+ Kd6 49. Rxe4 Kd5 50. f5 Rg3 51. Rfe8 c4 52. f6 Rf3+ 53. Ke2 Rxf6 54. Kxe3 Rc6 55. Rd4+ Kc5 56. Rb8 Re6+ 57. Re4 Rxe4+ 58. Kxe4 Nf2+ 59. Kf3 Ng4 60. Rb5+ Kd4 61. Rxh5 c3 62. Ke2 Ne3 63. Rg5 Nf1 64. Rg4+ Kc5 65. Kd3 c2 66. Rc4+ Kd6 67. Rxc2 Ng3 68. Rg2 Nf5 69. h5 Ke7 70. Rg5 Nd6 71. Rxa5 Kf6 72. Ra6 Ke5 73. Rxd6 Kxd6 74. h6 Kc5 75. h7 Kb6 76. Kc4 Kb7 77. Kc5 Kc7 78. h8=Q Kd7 79. Qe5 Kc8 80. Kc6 Kd8 81. a5 Kc8 82. Qh8# 1-0

Jul-29-08		rinus: Checkmate at move 82?

Jul-29-08		DPLeo: Here's a hi ply on 61.Rxh5 versus 61.Rxa5 After 60...Kd4 Depth=29 1. (16.82): 61.Rxh5 Ne3 62.Rg5 Nf1 2. (10.31): 61.Rxa5 c3 62.Ke2 Nf2 Shredder thinks Rxh5 is the way to go.

Jul-29-08		amadeus: <kb2ct: 61.<Rxa5> c3 62.Ke2 Nf6 63.Rf5 Ne4 64.<Rf4> Ke5 65. Ke3> Rybka 2.2n2, 24-ply (5-men tb) +M28 65...Nd6 66.Rb4 c2 +M27 65...Nc5 66.Rc4 Kd6

Jul-29-08		MostlyAverageJoe: In case GMT plays Kc6, here's a sadistic line that <kb2ct> should like (-: 60. Rb5+ Kc6 61. Rxa5 Kb7 62. Rxh5 Nf6 63. Rc5 Nd7 click for larger view And now we walk into a fork and trade our rook for a pawn: 64. Rxc4 Ne5+ 65. Ke2 Nxc4 click for larger view TB mate in 22.

Jul-29-08		kb2ct: <If Shredder doesn't evaluate this above +9.00, I would be surprised. A centralized king is the last straw > :0) 61. Rxa5 c3 62. Ke2 Nf6 63. Rf5 Ne4 64. Rf4 Ke5 65. Ke3 Nc5 (65... c2 66. Rxe4+ Kd5 67. Kd2) 66. a5 Na6 67. Rc4 Kd6 68. Rxc3 Analysis by Rybka 2.3.2a 32-bit : 68...Kd5 69.Rc8 Nb4 70.Rh8 Kc6 71.Rxh5 Nc2+ 72.Kf2 Nd4 73.Rh6+ Kd7 74.a6 Kc7 75.Rh7+ (9.17) Depth: 23 01:57:20 591572kN

Jul-29-08		kb2ct: <MostlyAverageJoe: In case GMT plays Kc6, here's a sadistic line that <kb2ct> should like (-:> I admit my motives for looking at Rxa5 weren't exactly pure. :0)

Jul-29-08		awdunno: Julia Roberts? She's old. I want Jessica Alba.

Jul-29-08		newton296: what the ! this game is still going on? even a chess wimp like me can look at the board and realize that we can just sac our rook for his remaining c pawn while at the same time we promote one of our wing pawns.

Jul-29-08		kb2ct: The truth of what to play is complex because evaluations have nothing to do with tablebases. GMT is playing on because there is a draw trap. I don't have a clue how he will respond in we play Rxh5 first and avoid the trap. I suspect he expects Rxa5 and will do a double take if we play Rxa5 first and completely avoid the trap, but again I don't really know his response. Rxh5 and Rxa5 initially evaluate differently because Rxh5 gets a three move head start. This is more than made up for by tablebase traps. By move 66. Rxa5 has a slight evaluation lead. Despite the initial evaluation difference it is a toss up which is better. People have different choice criteria than computers. :0)

Jul-29-08		pferd: <kb2ct: 61.Rxh5 c3 (or Ne3) 62.Ke2 Ne3 (or c3) 63.Rg5 63....Nf1 !! + +7.27/22 No tablebase win for quite some time.> click for larger view White plays 64.Rg4+ Kb5(or c5 but not d5 which loses the Knight) 65.Kd3 c2 66.Rg5+ (to avoid the fork) Kb4 67.Kxc2 and if 67...Kxa4 its a tablebase win in 12. Easy win with 61.Rxh5

Jul-29-08		MostlyAverageJoe: < kb2ct: ... I suspect he expects Rxa5 and will do a double take if we play Rxa5> ??? Why would he do a double take if we play what he expects? Please clarify.

Jul-29-08		whatthefat: <kb2ct: GMT is playing on because there is a draw trap.> Care to enlighten us as to what the 'draw trap' is?

Jul-30-08		kb2ct: <MostlyAverageJoe: < kb2ct: ... I suspect he expects Rxa5 and will do a double take if we play Rxa5> ??? Why would he do a double take if we play what he expects?> Typo.....I meant he expects Rxh5 and will do a double take if we play Rxe5 :0)

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