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| Jun-10-07 | | shortsight: This is so hard that no one care to comment? i only manage to get the 1st move, but i have a different variation for subsequent moves, and that the solution was so long that i felt dizzy looking thru the whole line! whoa, a definitely hard one for my standard. |
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Jun-10-07
 | | An Englishman: Good Evening: I was certain of the first three moves, but after that, the number of possible variations was too much for me. I've nothing but respect for Trabattoni's ability to see all this, but I wonder how much was home preparation. |
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| Jun-10-07 | | willyfly: The only move I got right was 17 g6. Kudos to Trabattoni. Very nicely done! |
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| Jun-10-07 | | MJW 72: Easy pullze/game postion. Only two moves are Bxg7 and g6. Everything else loses due to black's extra peice. One just needs to see that Bxg7 leads nowhere and then play g6 and hope for the best. Knight sac was awsome though. |
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| Jun-10-07 | | think: A couple of questions and comments. What happens after 20. ... gxh6? I think White's reply is Rg1+, but there are many options here that I cannot see without a chessboard handy. Also, I thought the double pawn pin after White's 21st was nice looking. |
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| Jun-10-07 | | dzechiel: Sunday. Let's try again. White to move.
The first thing that strikes me is the pin of the pawn on f7, so I want to play a move like 17 g6 to try and exploit it. If 17...hxg6 then 18 Rxg6 threatening 19 Rxg7+ and 20 Qh5#. If black doesn't take with the h-pawn (say 17...h6), then 18 gxf7+ Rxf7 (18...Kh8 isn't any better) 19 Rxg7+ is still winning. So, this line looks to have promise:
17 g6 hxg7 18 Rxg6 and now black can block the dark diagonal with: - 18...Ne5
- 18...Nf6
- 18...Bf6
It seems that other moves allow white too much access to g7. 18...Ne5 seems the most resourceful, as it now also threatens the rook. It looks to me that after 18...Ne5 white can play 19 Rdg1 and black is still in a world of hurt. 19...Nxg6 20 Rxg6 Bxd5 21 Rxg7+ Kh8 and white can capture the bishop and queen with a "rocker" (or sometimes called "windmill"). If 18...Nf6 19 Rdg1 keeps up the pressure.
If 18...Bf6 19 Rxg7+ Bxg7 20 Qg4 Ne5 21 Bxe5 exe5 22 Rg1 seems to do it. There's other lines, but all of this looks good to me. Time to check. |
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| Jun-10-07 | | chessmoron: 15 Nd5!! was nicer. Don't know why isn't that a puzzle move? What about 17...Bf6? |
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| Jun-10-07 | | dzechiel: Right idea, but missed black's reply completely! Looking forward to Monday. |
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| Jun-10-07 | | MostlyAverageJoe: My solution was: 17. g6 and hope the black will make a mistake. I could not figure out any winning lines after 17 ... Bf6. Gotta fire up my software ... |
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| Jun-10-07 | | THE pawn: I agree with <chessmoron> the whole combination (that I missed with the exception of the first move) was nice, but 15.Nd5 was even nicer! |
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| Jun-10-07 | | vibes43: 17. g6 seemed like a natural for a Sunday puzzle. Week ending puzzles are too much for me but I enjoy drilling through several layers of play. |
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| Jun-10-07 | | TrueBlue: saw g6 in 2 seconds. Also saw Rxg6 if black plays hxg6. Also so Qh5. I am not good at calculations, but intuition was definitely for g6 and it was right! I didn't see Ne5 for black and not sure if it is the best difference, but there are A LOT of possible lines. Any ways, g6 looks like a strong move, one should get credit even if they don't check all the lines. |
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| Jun-10-07 | | Gilmoy: Looks like a Sicilian after an Nd5 sac. The 16th move must have been 16.g5 Nd7, leaving Black momentarily with no K-side defenders. Black threatens Bxd5 and Ne5(-Ng6) to gum up the attack, so White probably has no time for a quiet move. Candidates: g6, Qh5, Bxf7, Bxg7. Of these, 17.g6 looks most promising, to uncover the R. f7 is pinned, hence: 17.. h6 18.gxf7+ Rxf7 19.Rxg7+ collects the R; 18.. Kh8 19.Bxg7+ Kh7 20.Bxh6! and Black's K is hopelessly exposed. 17.. hxg6 18.Rxg6 and it's the windmill again.
17.. Bxd5 18.gxh7+ Kh8 19.Bxg7+ and Qh5 mates.
So it seems that Black must block the long diagonal. 17.g6 Bf6 18.Qh5 (mate threat) hxg6 (h6 19.gxf7+ Kh8 20.Bxf6 Nxf6 21.Qg6) 19.Rxg6 (threatens 20.Bxf6 Nxf6 21.Rxg7+ Kxg7 22.Rg1+ mating) and ... 19.. Bxd4 20.Rxd4 Bxd5 21.Rxg7+! Kxg7 22.Qg5+ K(h7,h8) 23.exd5 mating. 19.. Ne5 20.Rh6! (mate threat) gxh6 21.Rg1+ Bg7 22.Qxh6 mating. Plan B is the B-sac 17.Bxg7 Kxg7 18.g6 -- but it unpins the f-pawn, so fxg6 is possible, and then White can't pierce g. The f7-pin is critical in all of the above lines -- White won't find a stronger replacement for it in the other lines. By the same reasoning, 17.Bxf7+ dissolves the pin, and 17.Qh5 lets Black do it (Bxd5), so I'll reject them, too. |
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| Jun-10-07 | | Gilmoy: Saw the key ideas -- Toth did too, hence he put up a better fight :) 19.Rxg6 is untouchable (Nxg6 20.Qxg6 mating at g7). My last line as of 20 is identical by transposition -- Black returns the piece to avoid the losing gxh6 line. After 22.Bxf7+ Kf8 23.Rh8+ Ke7 24.Rxc8 Rxc8 25.Bxf6+ gxf6 26.Bb3 White would have been 2 pawns up, and Black has no good answer for 27.Q(g7,f7)+ trading Qs. |
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Jun-10-07
 | | sleepyirv: I wonder how many moves Trabattoni saw after 17. g6. It's the best move, and the couple lines I went down worked out well for White... but I certainly couldn't have seen all the variations |
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| Jun-10-07 | | PositionalTactician: A really nice puzzle! |
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| Jun-10-07 | | Fezzik: I saw 17.g6 and the contours of the attack immediately, but I am sure Black could have played better at several stages. It's too late in the evening for me to work it out, but I have a feeling Black may have been able to hold this one. |
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| Jun-10-07 | | MostlyAverageJoe: <chessmoron: What about 17...Bf6?> This should be probably: "What about 17 ... Bf6!", because it seems to be a much better move than the one played in the game. After 17 ... Bf6, white does not seem to have a win, and the position evaluates as slight advantage for the black (-0.25). I have two observations about this puzzle (aided by Hiarcs): 1) Any other move for the white is quite a bit worse and maintains about one minor piece worth of advantage for the black. 2) Any other response by the black except 17 ... Bf6 gives advantage to white. Therefore, this puzzle falls into the category of "find the best move that furhtermore has a good chance of luring the opponent into a trap." <Gilmoy>: 17.g6 Bf6 18.Qh5 <mate threat> hxg6 <h6 19.gxf7+ Kh8 20.Bxf6 Nxf6 21.Qg6> 19.Rxg6 <threatens 20.Bxf6 Nxf6 21.Rxg7+ Kxg7 22.Rg1+ mating> Here's the position, black to move: 
click for larger viewBlack can extricate himself from the above with: 19 ... Bxd4! Now, two lines: FIRST: 20. Rdg1 Bxd5, and the best white can do is sac a rook for a perpetual check, because if 21. Rh6? with a mate threat, then 21 ... Qxc2+! 22. Kxc2 Bxe4+ 23. Kd2 g6 and no more mate for the white (in fact, black is winning, evaluating at -3.56). Here's the position: 
click for larger viewSECOND: another possibility for white after 19 ... Bxd4 is 20. Rg6 (the same mate threat that was losing in the above line). Here, the line goes: 20 ... Bxb2+ 21. Kxb2 Qc3+ 22. Kb1 gxh6 (note that 23. Qxh6 Qg7 loses for white - evaluates at -4.97) 23. Rg1+ Kh7 and white has no win: 
click for larger viewBTW, in <Gilmoy>'s line: <17.g6 Bf6 18.Qh5> black can do even better with 18 ... Rfc8. |
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| Jun-10-07 | | Fezzik: Re: 17...Bf6!?
This is the move I've been stuck on. I had a slightly different idea for White: 17...Bf6 18.gh7+ Kh8 (forced) 19.Rxg7!?/?! I'm pretty sure this forces 19...Kxg7 and then I don't know if White is winning. White's most interesting move may not be to check, but to play 20.Qf3!?/?! This all involves a huge sacrifice, and I don't know if it works so I wouldn't play it. Unless of course I was already in trouble... |
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| Jun-10-07 | | MostlyAverageJoe: More mistakes in that game (all analysis at 16 plies or so). 18 ... hxg6?? evaluates at +7.13. A better move (impossible to find OTB, I think): 18...Bg5 only +0.85) 20 ... Ng6?? evaluates at +17.25 (again, Bg5 was better, at +7.89). White should've responded 21.Bxf6!, but did not, and gave back most of the advantage with 21.Qxg6 (+3.88). 25. Qh5+? (white's advantage is down to +2.51).
28 ... Bc6? evaluates at +4.34 (28 ... Bf5 is +2.94)
and a couple more small ones.
<Fezzik> Your last line with 20.Qf3 is sound. Small advantage for the black. 19 ... Bxd4 also works instead of Kxg7, but not as good. |
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| Jun-10-07 | | Manic: <MJW 72> I don't see how you can consider this an easy puzzle. Looking over all the comments, it doesn't appear easy. Getting the first move is easy, I admit. But if that counts as getting the puzzle, then most of these would be pointless. I ask you now, did you see all these lines? I very much doubt it, looking at your comment. As for me, I missed black's reply completely as well. Guess I have to spend more time looking at the possible defences. |
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| Jun-10-07 | | jokerman: what's the main idee of 15) Nd5?
i can't see why white would play such a move. was it because he saw the whole combo? (wich are 18 moves!?!) could someone just please explain why this sac is good or bad. it would help me a lot! thnx |
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| Jun-10-07 | | realbrob: This is the game I played against Junior 8
17.g6 Bf6 18.Qh5 hxg6 19.Qxg6 Rc8 20.c3 Bxd5 21.Qh6 Ne5 22.Qxf6 g6 23.exd5 bxc3 24.f4 cxb2+ 25.Kxb2 Qc2+ 26.Ka1 Rc4 27.fxe5 Rxd4 28.Rc1 Qe4  Notice that until move 19 the program was sure I was losing.. |
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| Jun-10-07 | | goodevans: <Manic: … did you see all these lines? I very much doubt it> Let’s be a bit pragmatic about this. Sure, just guessing the initial move doesn’t constitute solving the puzzle, but nor do you have to analyse every possible defence. I, for one have neither the patience nor, let’s be honest, the ability for that. What’s more, in a position where the defence’s moves aren’t forced, I doubt whether even much stronger players than me could consider every line. How many can claim to have considered <MAJ>’s rather surprising 17 g6 Ne5 (?!) 18 Qh5 Bg5! For my part I saw 17 g6 as the strongest candidate, saw that the other candidates had adequate defences against them, checked that there were no complete rebuttals of 17 g6 and concluded “It’s got to be 17 g6 because it gives white a promising looking attack whereas black seems to have an answer to everything else”. It’s years since I played competitively, but I’d like to think I’d come to the same conclusion OTB. Does that constitute solving the puzzle? Please say “yes” coz I don’t often manage the Sunday puzzle! |
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| Jun-10-07 | | ClassZPlaya: <Mostly Average Joe> Thanks for the excellent analysis of the response 17. ... Bf6! I couldn't find a win for White after this either and thought there was no real solution to this puzzle. Best I could come up with White was <Fezzik's> line after 18. gxh7+, which looks like a strong attack but doesn't seem to win. |
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Kibitzing
sac: 15.Nd5