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May-07-05
 | | Ron: Just played some FisherRandom games that had the following setup of pieces: R-B-K-N-Q-R-B-N. My first three moves were f4, e4, and Ng3. This seems fine for White; Black, though, should have no problem to reach equality. My little contribution to the opening theory of FisherRandom chess. |
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May-13-05 | | blu4x5: how do i play this game
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May-13-05 | | halcyonteam: Can i play this on chessgames.com?
Or is this just merely a generator for starting position? |
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May-13-05 | | radu stancu: <halcyonteam> Just a generator. Look in chessgames' help page for online playing sites. Some of them also include a Fischerrandom option. |
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May-13-05 | | Stevens: I think there could be a sign somewhere on this page that makes it clear that this is only a generator, not a playable game. Every time i visit this page someone else is asking to play a game! |
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May-13-05 | | ughaibu: It can be played at http://brainking.com/en/GameRules?t... |
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Jun-03-05 | | Montreal1666: It is good to hear Fischer speaking in a civilized maner. I hope he adopts
that now in order to be able to have an active role in the society. |
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Jun-03-05
 | | TheAlchemist: <everybody> I would really like to see Fischer play FRC and then the position no. 54 is drawn. Take a look at it! Lol. Imagine his face when it's set up! |
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Jun-03-05 | | Jimzovich: I say Karpov vs. Fischer. Random Chess match, that would sell! |
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Jun-06-05 | | oblivion95: I recently ran a 210 game blitz tournament with 7 engines that can play FR chess. The most interesting result: BLACK WON MORE OFTEN THAN WHITE!
I thought that was strange, and it would require more statistics to prove. So I looked at the FR database at chess-960.org. If you select computer-only players, there are 117 games. If you sort by result and count wins, losses, and draws for White, you find 43-61-13. (For the human players, it is 254-231-58 in 543 games.) Combining that with my 81-106-23 in 210 games gives 124-167-36 in 327 games. That's 38%-51%-11% with a std. dev. of 5%, so it's statistically significant. Possibly White tends to over-extend. Whatever the reason, this disproves the claim that Fischerandom necessarily favors White more than classic chess. I'm curious about whether others have noticed the same thing. |
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Jun-06-05 | | oblivion95: There is another position calculator at
http://chess-960.org/14524.html
Unfortunately, it uses a different formula, and classic chess turns out to be position #518. (It has a difficult interface. Paste rnbqkbnr into the first box, click the 3rd button, then click the 2nd button. The 1st button chooses a random position.) I hope the position numbers are standardized soon. |
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Jun-06-05 | | oblivion95: The best way to play FR against a computer is to use the Arena GUI. http://www.playwitharena.com
or for a version which has several FR engines,
http://www.chessbox.de/Compu/fullch...
(They included the wrong version of Betsy, and some of the engines only handle FR as Winboard engines, rather than UCI, but it's easy to get something working.)Arena is wonderful for engine-engine tournaments. In my testing, Gothmog was the best at FR Blitz. I set it to "Agressive" in the .ini file, and it becomes a great engine to play against, with all sorts of speculative sacrifices. So I recommend the Gothmog engine. |
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Jun-06-05 | | oblivion95: The best way to play FR against a human is at freechess.org. Get a free account, try the jave GUI, and "seek wildfr" to get request a game. Better: download BabasChess, the best GUI for FICS (aka freechess.org). It has a menu option for FR. |
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Jun-06-05 | | oblivion95: Watching engine-engine games in Arena is great fun -- and very interesting. Because there are no opening books, one can discern an engine's style within just a few moves. Here are my impressions of the personalites of the available engines: * Betsy follows Steinitz's principles: create a strong pawn center and develop the pieces toward the center. It lacks much positional knowledge, so it loses in the middlegame, despite its relatively high search speed. * Chispa is a solid engine, capable of stealing a point from any of the others. It typically concentrates on pawn structure, then flounders in the middlegame. It reminds me of Tarrasch's style. * The best thing about Gothmog is not its surprising strength at lightning chess (though it does not calculate many nodes per second) but rather its courageous attacks. (Gothmog was set on "Aggressive", which according to the author should weaken it. I think it becomes stronger in Fischerandom.) At its best, it plays like Morphy, leaving pawns (or even pieces) unprotected when their capture might lead to a quick victory. It also plays amazingly well in the endgame; I've watched the evaluations swing several points. * Its nemesis is Hermann, which defends solidly but otherwise plays a rather tepid game. Gothmog was able to pull out several draws against Hermann only because of relative endgame strength. I liken it to Lasker. * The Baron plays the most well-rounded game: fairly defensive, energetic middlegame, good endgame (but not quite as good as Gothmog in the games I watched). It is the antidote to Hermann. I expect it to be best at slower games. It reminds me of Capablanca. * The other surprise is Frenzee, which had won the whole tournament handily until I added Gothmog into the mix. Frenzee reminds me of Nimzowich with its prophalactic style. It often leaves opponents burdened with a bishop in the corner, trapped behind its own pawns. No FR engine plays like any champion post-Alekhine. I think he was the first to devote his life to opening theory. |
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Jun-06-05 | | oblivion95: Here is a fun Gothmog game. Watch the opponent's King wander around, while its protectors sit idly by. The exchange sacrifice at move 17 (made when White is already 2 pawns down in material) is completely speculative, drawing the Black King to the 4th rank. That's a very impressive move for a computer (and remember, there were only 3 seconds of thinking time). Gothmog's evaluation jumps 300 centipawns at move 26, but not because of an unexpected move (Black creates a passed pawn on the sixth rank, to no avail); it just suddenly became evident that the attack was succeeding. Chispa didn't realize the direness of the situation until move 28, but Chispa was actually calculating 1 ply deeper the whole time! (9 plies versus 8).
<pre>
[White "Gothmog-frc"]
[Black "Chispa 4.03"]
[Result "1-0"]
[FEN "qbnrkrbn/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/QBNRKRBN w KQkq - 0 1 "]1.Nh1-g3 f7-f6 2.c2-c3 Nh8-g6 3.Bb1xg6+ h7xg6 4.f2-f3 c7-c6 5.f3-f4 Bg8-d5 6.e2-e4 Bd5-e6 7.d2-d4 d7-d5 8.e4-e5 g6-g5 9.Qa1-b1 g5xf4 10.Ng3-h5 g7-g5 11.Nh5-g7+ Ke8-f7 12.Ng7xe6 Kf7xe6 13.Nc1-b3 b7-b6 14.0-0-0 f6xe5 15.d4xe5 Bb8xe5 16.Rf1-e1 Ke6-d6 17.Re1xe5 Kd6xe5 18.Qb1-g6 e7-e6 19.Rd1-e1+ Ke5-d6 20.Re1xe6+ Kd6-d7 21.Nb3-d4 Rd8-e8 22.Re6xc6 f4-f3 23.Qg6xg5 Nc8-e7 24.Rc6-h6 Rf8-g8 25.Qg5-e5 Rg8xg2 26.Rh6-d6+ Kd7-c8 27.Qe5-e6+ Kc8-b7 28.Qe6-d7+ Kb7-a6 29.Nd4-e6 Rg2xg1+ 30.Kc1-d2 Rg1-g2+ 31.Kd2-d3 Qa8-c8 32.Qd7-a4+ Ka6-b7 33.Rd6-d7+ Qc8xd7 34.Qa4xd7+ Kb7-b8 35.Qd7xe8+ Ne7-c8 ( 1-0 Arena Adjudication)
</pre>
(36.Qf7 Ne7 37.Qxe7 Rg8 38.Qc7+ Ka8 39.Nd8 Rxd8 40.Qxd8+) Black's passed pawn on the sixth rank didn't help at all. |
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Jun-08-05
 | | offramp: From <Major Cat>
Presently, Chess960 or Fischer Random Chess seems to represent the leading
edge of Baseline Chess in historical evolutionary terms. Chess960 imposes
an additional constraint on the starting setup, namely, that the King be
flanked by the Rooks. To this effect, the FIDE rules applicable to castling
are suitably extended. Chess960 allows for 960 different starting setups.
However, due to symmetry, only 480 of its starting setups would require
separate study and analysis. The FIDE starting position is one of them. :) I am of the humble opinion that, what with its 480 substantively distinct
variants, Chess960 is still...overkill! Instead, Baseline Chess variant
enthusiasts may want to focus on...Chess18. Chess18 comprises a small
subset of Chess960 variants. This subset maintains the King and Rooks on
their orthodox squares. Thus, no extension to the FIDE rules applicable to
castling is necessary. To boot, all 18 variants are substantively distinct
and would require separate study and analysis. The FIDE starting position
is still one of them. :)
Chess18 would still make "booking up" quite a formidable challenge. Chess
playing computer programs could easily accommodate it. Moreover, dedicated
chess position databases could be easily modified to support Chess18 opening
theory research and training.
Could Chess18 opening theory research and play galvanize enough interest
over the long haul so as to create a hobbyist subculture of some permanency? <Major Cat>
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Jun-10-05 | | JonasD: Hello, nice to see that my chess-960.org project is usefull for others. :-) oblivion95: I'm searching for more chess960 games, do you have a collection of them as pgn files ? If yes, pls. contact me (info@chess-960.org). My impression is white and back have nearly the same chance to win over all 960 positions. (324-318-91) |
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Jun-10-05 | | JonasD: To promote this website a little more I can tell that there are all games of the worldchampionsships 2004 and 2003 inside.
Additionaly the tournaments to qualify for the Worldchampionship (wtih a lot of GM), some games played on SchemingMind.com and some computer matches with not commercial (but strong) chess960 engines. Enjoy it and send me more games as pgn. :-) http://www.chess-960.org/php/show_e... |
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Jun-10-05 | | popski: <oblivion95> Cool posts! Thank you! |
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Jun-10-05 | | firebyrd: <Gypsy: <all> I am picking up on the earlier conversation how to generate random starting positions without a help of an electronic device.> Using cards you can avoid having to reshuffle, by laying out black and white squares separate, making sure that one bishop goes to each, like this: Mix a queen, two jacks(=knights), and three kings(=rook+king+rook), and split in two piles of three. Mix one Ace(=bishop) in with each pile, and lay them out in rows for white and black squares respectively, eg: (white square row) Ks Qh Ac Kh
(black square row) Jh Kc Ah Jc
yields: NRKQBBNR
It is easy to see that this generates all FR positions with equal probability. Considering the 6 non-bishop cards only, they are all treated equally, and should have equal probability of ending anywhere. Shuffling these 6 cards will yield 6! = 720 possible sequences, but with 2 possible J-J permutations and 6 possible K-K-K permutations that does not change the FR position - thus there are 720/12=60 distinct KKKJJQ shuffles. Adding in the Aces, these can each go to any four places - for a number of 4*4 = 16 variants for each of the 60 shuffles above, creating 60*16=960
different FR setups. |
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Jun-10-05 | | firebyrd: Or using dice
- Throw a D6 to get the initial file for the Queen, and then roll twice to get the initial starting files for the knights, reroll if you hit an occupied file. - Place QNN on the indicated files and RKR on the three leftmost files available. - Throw the dice - and reroll 5's and 6's until you get a number n in the range 1-4. Place the black-squared bishop on the n'th black square, shifting other pieces to the right to make room. - Repeat with the white-squared bishop.
If you're a role-player you may have access to D4 or D20 that will allow you to do the above procedure without re-rolling. |
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Jun-13-05 | | vonKrolock: THE SIX O'KROLOCK NEWS: - from the internet: <Despite having a long and illustrious history, Stanley Random Chess (commonly designated SR Chess), is relatively unknown in the modern era due to the fact that it flourished in exclusive clubs and under the cover of secret societies. Not to be confused with Fischer Random Chess (FR Chess), SR Chess has only recently emerged into the modern public arena, where it is presented as a chess variant. Recent historical studies published by Dr. Bill Goldman have now offered conclusive proof that in fact the more commonly played "traditional" chess is merely an inferior and simplified variant of SR Chess. For this reason common chess is usually designated in SR Chess circles as Simplified Stanley Random Chess, or Simplified SR Chess.> Much more here http://www.geocities.com/verdrahcir... |
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Jun-13-05 | | refutor: why d6 for the queen's row? |
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Jun-13-05 | | firebyrd: <why d6 for the queen's row?> Because two places will be taken up by the bishops, there are 6 possible places the queen can go to - so throw a 6-sided die (D6). If you think it makes it easier to visualize, you can of course place the bishops first. Then after you throw a D6 for the queen you just count from the left, that many free files to place the queen. Eg. you start off by throwing a '1' for the b sq bishop (-> a1) and a '2' for the w sq bishop (-> d1), then a '4' for the queen, putting it on (b,c,e...) f1. You lose the direct correspondence between roll and file, but you gain in the way that pieces are never placed, and then moved - once you have rolled and placed a piece it stays there. It is probably a better procedure. |
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Jun-26-05 | | soberknight: I have a quiz for you all.
Set up the chess board as usual, but replace the queen with a grasshopper, which moves straight or diagonally like a queen, but must hop over another unit (of either color) and land one square beyond. Thus, White can play 1 Gf3, threatening both 2 Gxf8 and 2 Gxa8. (Black's best response is 1...Gf6!) There is a fool's mate in this chess variant, in which White makes two silly moves and gets checkmated. Can you find it? |
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