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< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 2 OF 3 ·
Later Kibitzing> |
Jun-24-05
 | | benveniste: <ongyj>: I see:
13.Nf5 Nxb3+
14.axb3 0-0
15.e5 dxe5
16.Nxe7+ Qxe7
17.Qxa8 g5
Black is down an exchange and a pawn due to the hanging rook. Nor is 15 ... exf5 16. exf6 any better. |
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Jun-24-05
| | benveniste: <RookFile> I see:
13. Nf5 Bb7
14. Nxg7+ Kf8
15. Bxf6 Nxb3+
16. axb3 Rg8
17. Nh5 Bxf6
18. Nxf6
Black is down a piece with no counterplay. |
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| Jun-24-05 | | mymt: the sac Nf5 & Nd5 together or by themselves are part of a collection of sacrificial themes in a book published in the late 60s or early 70s called [I think ]Sacrifices in the Sozin .It also included the piece sac to pick up the a b & d pawns as well as examlpes of sacs to open the h file . |
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| Jun-24-05 | | Castle In The Sky: <Chessgames and chesswonders> I had 1.e5 as a solution and missed ♘f5, does Crafty have anything to say about the "e5" variation? |
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| Jun-24-05 | | aginis: <jahhaj>, <maxundmoritz>
13...g5 14.Nxd6+! Bxd6 15.Qxf6 Be5 16.Nd5 exd5 17.exd5 O-O 18.Rxe5 gxh4 19.d6 Qd7 20.Qxh6 f6 21.Re7 Rf7 22.Rxd7 Bxd7  OR
15...Rg8 16.Rxd6! Qxd6 17.Rd1 Qb6
( 17...Qf4+ 18.Qxf4 gxf4 19.Rd8# or 17...Qc7 18.Bg3 Qa5 19.Nd5 exd5 [19...Qd8 20.Nc7+ Qxc7 21.Bxc7 Bd7 22.Bd6 any Qe7# or 19...Kd7 20.Qe7+ Kc6 21.Nb4+ Qxb4(Kb6) 22.Qc7#] 20.exd5+ Be6 21.dxe6 Nxe6 22.Rxe6+ fxe6 23.Qxe6+ Kf8 24.Qf7#) 18.Nd5 exd5 19.Qxb6
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| Jun-24-05 | | RookFile: Thank you benveniste, chess blindness
on my part. :) |
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| Jun-24-05 | | RookFile: Something about this opening isn't
quite right. I have a memory of a
game Benko won as black. What Benko
said was, the Sicilian isn't this easy. With white, maybe you can put
a bishop on c4, OR a bishop on g5,
but you don't get to do both. I
think there is some way for black to
not only equalize, but get the advantage against this approach. |
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| Jun-24-05 | | The beginner: I also keept looking for some way to solve it by playing e5. Threatening a8, and f6 at the same time. But as already mentioned by other kibitzers it dosent lead to anything after Bb7. <Rookfile>
Bb7 in reply to Nf5 loses a piece it leaves the knight on f6 under protected. 13 Nf5 ..Bb7?
14 Nxg7+
Here black must move his king, and after that white take the knight on Bxf6. |
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| Jun-24-05 | | patzer2: <RookFile> <I think there is some way for Black not only to equalize, but get the advantage against this approach> Perhaps 9...b5! 10. Na4 10...g5 as in K Soukos vs A Potapov, 2001 is worth considering. Also, 9...g5! Bg3 10...b5 = to  , Fritz 8's suggestion, might be OK for Black. |
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| Jun-24-05 | | patzer2: An expanded analysis of Tate's fascinating positional sacrifice 13. Nf5!! follows:
<13. Nf5!! Nxb3+>
[13...exf5 14. Bxf6 gxf6 15. Nd5 Qd8 16. Nxe7 fxe4 17. Qxf6 Rf8 18. Nd5 Qxf6 19. Nxf6+ Ke7 20. Nxe4 Nxb3+ 21. axb3 Rd8 22. Nxd6+ Be6 23. Nf5+ Kf6 24. Nd4 ; 13... g5!? 14. Nxd6+ Bxd6 15. Qxf6 Be5 16. Nd5! (This idea, found by <aginis>, improves over a long 8 hour computer analysis on my PC at 18 depth, which came up with 16. Bg3!? Bxf6 17. Bxc7 Bxc3 18. bxc3 Bb7 19. f3 Rc8 20. Be5 Rg8 21. Rd6 g4 22. Red1 Ke7 23. c4 f6 24. Bg3 Rgd8  ) 16...exd5 17. exd5! 0-0 18. Rxe5 Ra7 19. d6 Nxb3+ 20. axb3 Qd8 21. Bxg5! Qxf6 22. Bxf6 and White's two extra pawns and strong passer win easily.] <14. axb3 exf5 15. Bxf6 gxf6 16. Nd5!Qd8 17. Nxe7 Kxe7> (17... Qxe7? 18. exf5 pins and wins the Black Queen) <18. exf5+ Be6> (18... Kf8? 19. Qxa8 snares the Rook) <19. fxe6 fxe6 20. Qb7+!> This is an instructive deflection move, especially for novices. <20...Qd7> (20... Ke8 21. Rxe6+ Kf8 22. Rdxd6 ) <21. Rxe6+ 1-0> Play could continue 21...Kxe6 22. Re1+ , and White picks up the Black Queen for a quick finish. |
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Jun-24-05
 | | Sneaky: The sacrifice Nf5!! looked like a very thematic move in this sort of position, but working out the details is a real headache. |
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| Jun-24-05 | | YouRang: I got it in a millisecond.
Okay, I lied. But I can honestly say that the first move I considered was 13. Nf5, figuring that we needed to open the middle for the rooks. But after that, I got nowhere. And I failed to see why 18... Be6 was black's best move (until Patzer2 explained it). :( |
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| Jun-24-05 | | xxdsdxx: Well I got the theory for half credit. Rooks are in the center opposite the King. Clear the wood from the center and win the rook on A8 or trap the queen. But I did not understand Black trading down 13...Nc5xb3 before obliging and clearing a piece from the e-file. Whites natural next move 15. Bxf6 and Black must take with the pawn or the rook falls due to check. 16. Nd5 harasses the queen. A wrong move here and the queen falls. Very Good Game by Tate. It shows the level of calculating that goes into a game at this level. I can manage 3 maybe 4 moves but clearly not 7 yet! |
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| Jun-24-05 | | riqhi: argh... impossible for my level. |
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| Jun-24-05 | | RookFile: Thank you, patzer2. I do think
that somehow the move ...b4 is important. Fischer said that in this
type of position, black should play
that the first chance he gets. |
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| Jun-24-05 | | InspiredByMorphy: 12. ...Nc5 neglected development. After 12. ...O-O then 13.Nf5 is no longer effective. |
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| Jun-24-05 | | RookFile: but is 13. Bxe6 a problem, InspiredbyMorphy. |
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| Jun-24-05 | | melianis: considered 13 e5 Bb7 14. Nxe6 but it got too complicated after 14...fxe6, and might even lose for white. |
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| Jun-24-05 | | InspiredByMorphy: <RookFile> Yes that is a problem. However, comparitively speaking it is a much smaller problem to lose a pawn than to leave the king in the center facing such development from the opponent. Black neglected development in the opening and after whites 12th move it seems black has no choice but to lose a pawn for the sake of development. 12. ...O-O 13.Bxe6 Bb7 and blacks development looks like it may be able to achieve some counterplay, or perhaps give better chances for drawing. |
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| Jun-24-05 | | InspiredByMorphy: The following is a very good example of how black could have handled the opening differently. It looks as though 9. ...g5, followed by 10. ...b4 is more effective. L Kokkoris vs Fischer, 1968 |
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| Jun-24-05 | | kevin86: I failed this one-I saw e5,but I know black could parry with Ne4---have good weekend,everybody! |
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| Jun-24-05 | | aw1988: I considered e5 with the idea of sacrificing the queen after Bb7, but it leaves white's position with too many holes. |
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| Jun-24-05 | | snowie: This was not easy to see at all. The
check by white's Q, followed by Rx +
was a beauty! |
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| Jun-24-05 | | aw1988: This is only Friday. I shudder to think what the Sunday puzzle will be like. |
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| Jun-24-05 | | yoozum: Yeah, I totally missed this one. Maybe CG.com thinks it's Sunday ;-) |
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Kibitzing
sac: 13.Nf5
