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Dec-26-10 | | Once: <al wazir: Chess in essentially its current form has been played since ca. 1500. Does anyone seriously doubt that 1. e4 e6 occurred thousands of times --perhaps millions -- prior to 1836?> You can say the same thing about just about any opening. But we have got to call openings something, and so a name tends to stick at some point. It may not relate to the very first time that the opening was played, but it could be the first time that the opening was noticed by serious players or was played at the highest level with any success. Here we have a high profile game between two of the most pre-eminent capital cities at the time. And the French team wheel out an opening that may have been played before by patzers but which wasn't taken seriously by anyone else. That fount of all knowledge Wikipedia says that one of the French players came up with idea of 1...e6: "The French Defence is named after a match played by correspondence between the cities of London and Paris in 1834 (although earlier examples of games with the opening do exist). It was Chamouillet, one of the players of the Paris team, who convinced the others to adopt this defense" And what is more, the Parisian team wins quite handily with their "new" opening. I'd say that is reason enough to name a chess opening. We should be grateful for small "merci"s. If fate had been unkind, we might now be calling it the Chamouillet defence, and imagine how hard that would be to spell! |
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Dec-26-10
 | | Phony Benoni: There is a PGN file of historic correspondence games at http://www.endgame.nl/cc-history.htm, which includes the two "London-Paris" games. These include some notes, apparently by Jan van Reek: "Cercle de Philidor of Paris had sent a challenge to London in 1822 but no match occurred. A new challenge was made on 29 i 1834. The Westminster Chess Club accepted and each side entered 50 pounds. London mailed the first move in February 1834. The Channel could be crossed by a steamboat. Paris' team met at 48, Rue Neuve Vivienne and had to answer in a fortnight. Pierre de Saint Amant led the Frenchmen." <1.e4 e6>
"The name French Defence was given after Paris had won this game. Actually, the first move had been applied in Antwerp - Amsterdam 1827-9 (in which Black won), but the name Dutch Defence was used for another opening later." This file gives the 27-move version, by the way.
The notes for the other game in the match (Paris vs London, 1834) indicate that it ended in October, 1836, which confirms <Once>'s speculation about the differing dates. As for the other version of the game (which was also used as a GOTD!), I'm more of a database purist myself and would rather see just one version. What might work would be to take the posts from the deleted version and put them at the beginning of the kibitzing of the remaining version, perhaps indicating that they are from a deleted version of the game. |
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Dec-26-10
 | | al wazir: <Once>: I don't object to the name; as you say, we have to call it something. (Though the importance of that can be overstated. As the Gnat said to Alice, do they answer to their names?) But I doubt your conjecture that serious players had never thought seriously about the opening before 1836. |
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Dec-26-10 | | theodor: allez, gaules!<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galati...; |
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Dec-26-10
 | | AylerKupp: I remember reading a beginner's chess book (I think it was by I.A.Horowitz) in which the French defense was described as "King's pawn sneaks one". An apt description. |
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Dec-27-10 | | kevin86: A great finish by black! White's pawns can be stopped. |
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Jan-27-11 | | David2009:  click for larger view 5...c5! has just been played. A quick trawl of the data base reveals 6 dxc5 Bxc5 7 0-0 is White's best chance of making something out of nothing, since if 6 0-0 then 6...c4! gives Black good play. |
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Feb-05-11
 | | Penguincw: The black ♔ is going to approach the white ♙s and black is going to be winning. |
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Jan-02-13
 | | perfidious: <Once> We may be thankful that Dame Fate did not bestow Mr Chamouillet's name upon 1.e4 e6. |
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Jul-04-13 | | kia0708: The French defeated the British. |
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Aug-20-13 | | SBC: I know the more important members of the Cercle des Panoramas. Does anyone happen to know, or know where to find, the members of the Westminster Club on Bedford street in 1834 who might have participated in the correspondence match? |
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Aug-20-13 | | whiteshark: <SBC: I know the more important members of the Cercle des Panoramas. Does anyone happen to know, or know where to find, the members of the Westminster Club on Bedford street in 1834 who might have participated in the correspondence match?> UltraCorr database refers to <"The Write Move"> by Tim Harding. Hopefully you'll hit paydirt there. |
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Aug-21-13 | | SBC: Thanks. I'm not sure "The Write Move" has what I'm looking for, but Tim Harding is definitely the go-to guy on early UK chess. You also made me think of the Streatham and Brixton C.C. which has marvelous historical resources. |
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Jun-07-17
 | | offramp: <Jul-16-05 farrooj: <dinesh> actually this London vs Paris, 1836 is the first ever recorded game in french defense> <Sep-04-08 Kink: There was, according to the chess history archives, two games played between these clubs. France won 2 - 0. Yet I cannot find a record of the other game anywhere. Does anyone know where I may find it?> It's amazing what you can see at chessgames.com. |
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Jun-07-17
 | | Annie K.: I see London, I see France...
;p |
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Jun-07-17
 | | An Englishman: Good Evening: Very good pun, but it does give the impression that Paris got plastered. |
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Jun-07-17 | | Ilkka Salonen: Is this the same London Chess Club with whom Staunton had differences during the tournament in 1851? |
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Jun-07-17 | | morfishine: Whoever voted for this game title must've been plastered ***** |
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Jun-07-17 | | rea: (1) this is the game that gave the French Defense its name, isn't it? (2) Even if the English team was using black-colored pieces, they were "white" because they moved first. The color of the physical pieces on the board doesn't matter. (and they were playing by correspondence anyway). (3)<kevin86>: "There is a joke going around that the "French defense" involves carrying an unicolor (white) flag,instead of the Tricolor-the regular flag."
The Bourbon French monarchy used a white flag (with gold lilies, but those were not very visible). With the Restoration in 1815, that flag was in use until 1830. The Orleanist King in 1836, Louis-Phillipe, used the tricolor, though. |
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Jun-08-17 | | ChemMac: <ajile> Did you mean 11 NXc6? Just off the top of my head, 11...bc 12.BXc6 Qb6 13. BXe8 d4 14. Ba4 Ba6 looks winning. Black is a R down, but seems to get back more than enough. |
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Jun-08-17 | | kevin86: French resistance! |
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Oct-28-17 | | Compound Error: Er, Badinage of Paris? |
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Oct-26-20 | | MelvinDoucet: This game was featured in the first volume of Le Palamède in 1836 and was annotated by none other than Monsieur de La Bourdonnais. The following is my translation of his annotations. Note thay the London CC had the black pieces and played first so I had to reverse colors in the translation. 6.♕e2+: <This move by white is a mistake. This check brings out a black piece and places the queen in front of the king, an often precarious position.> 8.♗e3: <By playing this move white wishes to defend the pawn which took the gambit of the queen,> [sic; perhaps referring to the fact that the c5 pawn was threatening white's queen pawn] <which is a risky defense. Better would have been to castle and let go of the pawn.> 9.♗b5: <This is a poor move which only helps to free the opponent's game.> 10.♘d4: <By bringing their knight to this square, white thinks they shall win a pawn or force black into a defensive move; they are again mistaken as the following moves shall demonstrate.> 11.♗xc6: <Had white taken the knight with their knight, black ought not to have recaptured but bring their queen to her knight's third square;> [i.e. b6] <with this move they would have regained their pawn with an excellent position.> 12.c3: <White cannot take the pawn with their knight, for if they did, black would win a piece by playing their queen to her knight's third square.> 14.♕d3: <Here it can be seen how precarious the queen's placement in front of her king was. With this move, white, in bringing their queen to her third square, plays quite poorly once again; it would have been better to bring her to her second square.> 23.♖xa7: <By taking this pawn and giving up their knight, white ends with a serious mistake a game which was played quite poorly from the onset. Had they wished to continue a game they ought to lose inexorably, then they had to retain this knight; by losing it, it is hard to believe they thought they could lead their pawns to promotion; fifteen days went by between each move of this game yet it takes no more than fifteen minutes to realize that black shall stop the white pawns in their tracks, emerging with an extra rook. § Besides, if every correspondence game were to be played this way, then this mode of playing ought to be abandoned for this game certainly is no exemplar and cannot help the game forward in spite of the fact it was played over the course of two years.> |
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Jan-16-24
 | | MissScarlett: Two versions were merged, the longer one carried the additonal moves: <28. c6 d2 29. Rxe8+ Kxe8 30. Ke2 Kd8 0-1>, but no source for this has yet been identified, and likely represent subsumed analysis. |
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Feb-19-25 | | stone free or die: Thanks for that explanation <Missy>, I happened across the duplicates in an old zipfile I had. |
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