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| Feb-07-04 | | InspiredByMorphy: The Budapest gambit is very overlooked and I am under the impression that most doubt or are unsure of its effectiveness. For those interested see Game Collection: Budapest gambit victories |
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| Mar-20-04 | | MoonlitKnight: I also have one: Game Collection: A52 - The Budapest Gambit |
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| Mar-21-04 | | ChessCurious: I am not sure its really a gambit (like Queens gambit). I played it for 5 years or so, and never has anyone, as white, seriously tried to hold the pawn. I love this opening, as black gets easy development and intiative (without really risking a pawn). What soured me somehwat on it though was getting crunched by White after b3!, Bb2 for white (after he dodges all the traps). Nevertheless I love it an play cause its fun. |
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| Mar-21-04 | | Helloween: I am of the inclination that White must win in all variations of the Budapest, with perfect play. I played a game earlier that went along the main line with 1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e5 3.dxe5 Ng4 4.Bf4 Nc6 5.Nf3 Bb4+ 6.Nbd2 Qe7 7.a3 Ngxe5 8.Nxe5 Nxe5 9.e3 and won in few moves because my opponent didn't think I'd play correct moves and had no idea what to do. This is a coffee house player's opening. |
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Mar-21-04
 | | Sneaky: Here's the line that I used to give Budapest players the most problems:
1.d4 ♘f6 2.c4 e5 3.dxe5 ♘g4 4.♘f3 ♗c5 5.e3 ♘c6 6.a3 a5 7.b3
If the Budapest is 'busted' I think this line is it.
See: Opening Explorer |
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| Mar-21-04 | | MoonlitKnight: Attempts to hold the pawn often falls into traps. In fact I played this blitz game yesterday: 1.d4 ♘f6 2.c4 e5 3.dxe5 ♘g4 4.♗f4 ♗c5 5.e3 ♘c6 6.♘f3 ♕e7 7.♕d5 ♘b4 8.♕e4? c6 9.h3?? d5 0-1 |
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| Mar-21-04 | | Vischer: MoonlitKnight, in your variation, white can play 6.Qxg4 |
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| Mar-21-04 | | MoonlitKnight: Lol, yes. It was of course 4...Nc6 5.Nf3 Bc5 6.e3. |
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| Mar-21-04 | | parinda: fyi . . .bacrot-shirov sarajevo 2000 11th round.. .a beautiful win by black in the budapest . . for some reason i can't find this game here. . nevertheless i'm sure you can search it out elsewhere. . .the shirov genius at work .. and one of my all time favorite games. . .check it out! |
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| Mar-21-04 | | PizzatheHut: <chessgames.com> I found the game that <parinda> is talking about. Can I upload to the website? If so how do I do that? |
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| Mar-21-04 | | ruylopez900: <ChessCurious>Two things. One is that the Queen's Gambit is not a true gambit. Black cannot hold on to the extra pawn no matter what. This in contrast to (say) the King's Gambit. Here Black can play the entire game a pawn up and not give it up. The other point is that It can still be a gambit even is people willingly return the pawn though if keeping the pawn seriously kills any hope of winning the pawn it isn't really a gambit. |
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| Mar-21-04 | | Benjamin Lau: RuyLopez900: that's not true at all, black CAN keep the pawn in the Queen's Gambit, it's just frowned upon and takes much more effort. |
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| Mar-21-04 | | ruylopez900: <Benjamin Lau> how do propose that Black holds on to the pawn?? If you refer to 1.d4 d5 2.c4 dxc4 3.e3 b5, it falls to 4. a4 when if Black captures both pawns are easily taken, a6 fails since after 5.axb5 the defending pawn is pinned. so we have 1.d4 d5 2.c4 dxc4 3.e3 b5 4.a4 c6 5.axb5 cxb5 <we have to hold onto the pawn! :)> 6.Qf3 and the Knight falls protecting the Rook (or the Bishop falls). If you have a genuine idea to keep the pawn I would be interested in seeing it. |
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| Mar-21-04 | | Benjamin Lau: ruylopez900, I guess you've never seen the Slav or Semi-Slav systems in much detail. One good way is to first decline the gambit, prepare a little, then take the pawn. (i.e. the sharp and imbalanced Noteboom/Abrahams Slav line: Miles vs J M Hodgson, 1996.) Black lost in that case, but there are many games in which he wins too, when he simplifies correctly and the connected queenside pawns outweigh the white center (which is more important in the middlegame.) There are also several other interesting ways of holding onto the pawn (Botvinnik Semi-Slav) but that's the way I think is best. |
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| Mar-21-04 | | Benjamin Lau: Btw, 1. d4 d5 2. c4 dxc4 3. e3 b5 is indeed a bad choice, but not all white players play the Queen's Gambit that way. For instance, the more aggressive 3. e4 prevents the Qf3 trick you mentioned earlier. 3. e3 allows for the tricky 3...e5! and black has very good piece play against the IQP. Compare this to a white 3. Nf3 which allows for b5!?. But now black cannot play ...e5! freeing his game and must settle for ...c5 which while also giving white an IQP, does not free black's game as much because the QB is still blocked. |
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Mar-21-04
 | | chessgames.com: <<PizzaTheHut> I found the game that <parinda> is talking about. Can I upload to the website? If so how do I do that?> PGN Upload Utility |
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| Mar-21-04 | | parinda: pizza. . so you don't have to do it all over again. .i already submitted the game. . thanks for the idea. .i found out how . . in 'Help' under frequently asked questions 'how do you get your games?'. . .in case you're interested in posting anything in the future. .best regards |
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| Mar-21-04 | | BiLL RobeRTiE: If White plays correctly in the King's Gambit Black cannot hold the pawn, i.e. 1. e4 e5 2. f4 exf4 3. Nf3 g5 4. h4 (4. Bc4?! Bg7!) g4 (4...gxh4 will lose both pawns, 4...f6? 5. Nxg5) 5. Ne5 and now in the lines 5...Nf6 6. Bc4 d5, 5...d6 6. Nxg4, 5...h5?! 6. Bc4, and 5...Bg7 6. d4, Black has either already lost the extra pawn or is close to it. Of course White has many other options like 3. Bc4 or 4. Bc4 which _are_ actual gambits, but I think that saying the King's Gambit is a true gambit is sort of overgeneralizing. |
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| Jul-06-04 | | centercounter: Sneaky: Here's the line that I used to give Budapest players the most problems: 1.d4 f6 2.c4 e5 3.dxe5 g4 4.f3 c5 5.e3 c6 6.a3 a5 7.b3 If the Budapest is 'busted' I think this line is it. Actually, that's the line I prefer to face, with the exception that if White prefaces it with a3, it's an additional tempo to Black in the Rook lift lines. |
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| Aug-26-04 | | milanez: Hi everyone
recently i played this game(as white), and did fairly well considering it was the first time i saw this opening. So, I would appreciate if anyone can point out the improvements to the moves i chose(for the first 18th or so, afterwards the play was rushed due to time winding down)
Tnx in advance!
1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 e5 3. dxe5 Ng4 4. e3 Nxe5 5. Nf3 Nc6 6. b3 Bb4+ 7. Nd2 d6 8. a3 Bxd2+ 9. Qxd2 Bg4 10. Be2 a5 11. Bb2 a4 12. Nxe5 Nxe5 13. Bxe5 Bxe2
14. Bxg7 Rg8 15. Kxe2 Rxg7 16. g3 Qf6
17. b4 Rg5 18. Rc1 Qe6 19. Qc2 Re5
20. Qxh7 Qg4+ 21. f3 Qd4 22. Qd3 Qxd3+
23. Kxd3 o-o-o 24. Rc3 f5 25. h3 1-0 |
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| Aug-26-04 | | clocked: b3 was the biggest mistake. Any pawn move creates weaknesses (a3 and c3). The weakness of c3 would have been felt after 8.a3 Bc3!. However the biggest problem is your opening the long diagonal. What you probably thought is that you would control it with Bb2, but black gets there first with Qf6. You don't have time for Bb2? because Nxf3+ and the bishop is lost. |
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| Aug-26-04 | | clocked: <Sneaky> I played your line a couple of weeks ago following Lautier v Illescas 1999 (which I don't see in chessgames) until move 13. Although Lautier won that game. I think black had an advantage out of the opening. Do you know of this game? and where would you improve for white? |
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| Aug-26-04 | | Everett: Helloween, since Short used it against Karpov in '93, and was fine out of the opening, I think it can be played against the best. |
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| Aug-27-04 | | RisingChamp: By the way the "correct" name of this opening is "The Budapest Defence to the Queens Gambit" which has been abbreviated to Budapest Gambit.And it is playable at any level just check out the results of GM Pavel Blatny or Romanian IM Georg Mohr.As for Helloweens opinion that it is a loss in all variations with perfect play-That would actually be true of nearly every defence black employs except the one defence which from a Gods eye viewpoint is correct.And beating someone who has "no idea what to do" doesnt prove a thing. |
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| Sep-04-04 | | Everett: Rising Champ, well said, except that bit about the name, being we live in this abbreviated world. Mohr's "The Budapest Defence to the Queen's Gambit" (whew!) games are psycho. He plays the Fara.. something or other continuation with 3.Ne4 yes? |
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