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< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 3 OF 3 ·
Later Kibitzing> |
| Sep-30-09 | | A Karpov Fan: I applied the valuable rule of calculating all forcing moves as far as possible here, and the solution emerged rapidly. |
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| Sep-30-09 | | gofer: 38 ... Ne2+
39 Kh1 Rf1+ 40 Kh2 Rh8+ 41 Rh3 g3#
39 Kh2 Rh8+ 40 Rh3 g3+ 41 Kh1 Rf1#
39 Rxe2 Rf1+ 40 Kh2 Rh8+ 41 Kg3 Bh5+ 42 Kxg4 Rf4+ 43 Kh3 Bf2# Time to check... |
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Sep-30-09
 | | gawain: Beautiful finish. |
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| Sep-30-09 | | Patriot: Nice puzzle. Unfortunately, I dismissed Ne2+ too early. I think the main reason for the mistake is that I was too busy trying to figure out how to make this a back rank mate. For example, 38...Ne2+ 39.Rxe2 g3 40.Nf3 Rh8 (threatening 41...Rfh6 and 42...Rh1#) but the rook on e2 can be moved giving the king an escape on e2. If there's a lesson to be learned from this, perhaps it is "Don't become too immersed in a plan without properly considering all forcing moves.". Or more to the point is "Whenever a king can be chased, consider hunting him down!". |
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| Sep-30-09 | | SuperPatzer77: <johnlspouge> Candidates (38...): Ne2+ 38…Ne2+ 39.Rxe2 [Kh1 Rh8+ 40.Rh3 gxh3 drops a R] [Kh2, same] Now, Black mates, as in the mate threat above:
39…Rf1+ 40.Kh2 Rh8+ 41.Kg3 Bh4+ 42.Kxg4 Rf4+ 43.Kh3 Bf2# <johnlspouge> Take a look at TheaN's excellent analysis: Analysis #1: 38...Ne2+!, 39. Kh1 Rh8+, 40. Rh3 Rf1+, 41. Kh2 g3# (40...Rf1+ is a lot better than 40...gxh3).  Analysis #2: 38...Ne2+! 39. Kh2 Rh8+, 40. Rh3 g3+! (40...gxh3??!!), 41. Kh1 Rf1# In my own opinion, 40...gxh3 in Analysis #1 and #2 is a waste of time. Just simple as that.
SuperPatzer77 |
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Sep-30-09
| | gawain: <Athamas: Looks like c5 is a pretty bad blunder, but what is white's best response? Nd3?> Yes, 38 Nd3 would have been best but surprisingly White would have been OK after 38 Kh2! 
click for larger viewWith the King at h2 38...Ne2 achieves nothing. And nothing comes of a rook check on the h-file now because when W moves the King back to g1 Black cannot then play ...Ne2, as the rooks are undoubled and will not threaten ...Rf1 any more |
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| Sep-30-09 | | Marmot PFL: This is a good mating net, made possible by the Ne1 blocking Rd1 from defending the back rank. Actually the first move I looked at was Nh3+ but quickly realized that black needed the h file open for a rook. so Ne2+ Rxe2 (forced) Rf1+ (Rf8 supports this check before leaving for the h file) Kh2 Rh8+ Kg3 Bh4+ Kxg4 Rf4+ Kh3 Bf2 or Bxe1 mate. And there you have it, a major rating upset over a 2550 player. |
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| Sep-30-09 | | mike1: Hi Gawain
Why does Ne2 does not achieve anything after your Kh2?
38.Kh2 Ne2! 39. Rxe2 Rf1
setting up the same idea as in the game.Only way to avoid the game continuation would be 40.g3 but R8f2+
41. Ng2 Rxd1 is the end. |
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Sep-30-09
 | | chrisowen: White squirms like a fish in a net but no avail. 38..Ne2 married with Rf1/ Rh8 is worth a shout as Bh4 will hook it in. |
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| Sep-30-09 | | kevin86: The mate that follows by discovered check is a version of Anastasia's mate with a bishop. Really neat! |
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| Sep-30-09 | | YouRang: I got it pretty quickly, since the black pieces are calling to be 'unsprung', and there is one clear way to go about it: 1. We need to move the knight with check (to get out of the way of the rook battery). 2. Then we need to move the rook with check (to get out of the way of the bishop). After that, it's just a matter of finding the forcing moves that drag the white king to its doom. 40...Rh8+ forces 41.Kg3, then 41...Bh4+ sets up the unavoidable ...Bf2# (eg. if 42.Kxg4, then 42...Rf4+ 43.Kh3 Bf2#). |
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Sep-30-09
| | gawain: <mike1: Why does Ne2 does not achieve anything after your Kh2? 38.Kh2 Ne2! 39. Rxe2 Rf1
setting up the same idea as in the game.Only way to avoid the game continuation would be 40.g3 but R8f2+ 41. Ng2 Rxd1 is the end.> How does B continue if White plays 40 Re4 in your line? Or 40 Kg3? I think she remains down a piece. 40 g3 would be a mistake as it allows a draw after 40 g3 Rh8+. But definitely not 40 g3 Rf2+?? Rxf2 which leaves Black a knight up. (After White's 39th her rook is on the 2nd rank, not the third--you may have overlooked this) |
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| Sep-30-09 | | jsheedy: I'm doing this all in my head, no board, so maybe I'm missing something, but here goes: 38...Ne2+, 39. Rxe2, Rf1+, 40. Kh2, Rh8+, 41. Kg3, Bh3+, 42. Kxg4, Rf4#. Lessee how I did.... |
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| Sep-30-09 | | jsheedy: OK, except it's 41...Bh4+, not 41...Bh3+. What I meant. |
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| Sep-30-09 | | Summerfruit: Material is even.
White's back rank is not protected, so:
38...Ne2+!
a) 39.Kh1/Kh2 Rh6+ (or Rh8+) 40.Rh3 gxh3 and black wins. b) 39.Rxe2 Rf1+ 40.Kh2 Rh8+ 41.Kg3 Bh4+
b1: 42.Kh2 Bxe1#/Bf2#
b2: 42.Kxg4 Rf4+ 43.Kh3 Bxe1#/Bf2# |
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| Sep-30-09 | | WarmasterKron: Got 38...Ne2+ easily, spent a bit of time working out the whole line. |
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| Sep-30-09 | | swordfish: It occurs to me a pun may be lurking in this game, something like "Miss Demina Assault." |
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| Sep-30-09 | | johnlspouge: < <SuperPatzer77> wrote: [snip] In my own opinion, 40...gxh3 in Analysis #1 and #2 is a waste of time. > Perhaps, but perhaps not. I analyzed a threat before deciding on 38...Ne2+. In my opinion, justification of the correct move (which I now frequently intuit) is more important than extensive calculation. By now, you probably grant me that I am quite capable of calculating, if I want to spend the time. I agree that the analysis I gave is not <best play>, because I did not spend the time to "update" my threat, but it <does> justify the candidate. < Just simple as that. > Diplomacy: a trait well worth cultivating.
Thanks for bringing <TheaN>'s superior analysis to my attention. |
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| Sep-30-09 | | ZUGZWANG67: I had to work on this one. And if my answer is the right one, then it would quite an achievment for me, an unrated player. Material is even. The BRs are strong and well coordinated, the g4-pawn is usefull because of its coverage of f3 and h3 plus the possibility of ...g3, and ...Ne2 is dangerous. Thus, 38. ...Ne2+. 39.Kh2 Rh8+ 40.Rh3 (40.Kh1 Rf1+ mate) 40. ...g3+ 41.Rh1 Rf1+ mate. 39.Kh1 Rf1+ 40.Kh2 Rh8+ 41.Rh3 g3+ is mate as well. It seems that the defensive ressource based on the arrival of a WR to h3 isn' t efficient. 39.Rxe2. The WR is denied of access to h3, but the g3-square is now available to the WK for for escaping. 39. ...Rf1+ 40.Kh2 Rh8+ 41.Kg3. Here' s the idea behind the elimination of the BN on move 39. But 41. ...Bh4+(!) 42.Kxg4 (42.Kh2 Bf2 + mate) 42. ...Rf4+ 43.Kh3 Bf2+ is mate. So according to my calculations, it' s mate in 5! Is that possible, considering a wednesday puzzle? Hm... Time to check! (GULP!)
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WOW! |
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| Sep-30-09 | | SuperPatzer77: <Summerfruit> <a) 39.Kh1/Kh2 Rh6+ (or Rh8+) 40.Rh3 gxh3 and black wins> In my opinion, 40...gxh3 is a waste of time.
After 38...Ne2+!, the correct move is as follows:
a) 39. Kh1 Rf1+, 40. Kh2 Rh8+, 41. Rh3 g3# (not 41...gxh3??!!) 0-1 b) 39. Kh2 Rh8+/Rh6+, 40. Rh3 g3+! (stronger than 40...gxh3), 41. Kh1 Rf1# 0-1 SuperPatzer77 |
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Sep-30-09
 | | fm avari viraf: Black is very dominant & can give TKO to White King by 38...Ne2+ 39.Rxe2 Rf1+ 40.Kh2 Rh8+ 41.Kg3 Bh4+ 42.Kxg4 Rf4+ 43.Kh3 Bf2# |
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| Sep-30-09 | | wals: Xie Jun - Julia Demina, Manila 1992
Analysis by Rybka 3 1-cpu:
1. = (0.18): 38.Nd3 Nxd3 39.Rexd3[] Rb8 40.Bxd6 Bxd6 41.Rxd6 Rxb3[] 42.Kh2 Rc3 43.Rd7+ Rf7 44.Rxf7+ Kxf7 45.Rd6 e4 46.Rd4 Re3 47.c5 Rc3 48.Rxe4 2.  (-0.72): 38.Nc2 Rh8 39.Nd4 g3 40.Bc1 Kf7 41.Nf3 Ke8 42.Ng5 Rfh6 43.Nh3[] Nxh3+ 44.gxh3 Rxh3 45.Kg2 Rh2+ 46.Kxg3 Kf7 47.b4 Rc2 48.Re4 Rc8 49.b5 38.c5 a poor choice by White. |
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| Sep-30-09 | | wals: ChessGames - Would the setting of a time standard for each puzzle category
aid in giving a reality check.
For example I spent minutes on this medium/easy puzzle which an expert would have solved in seconds.
Solving a puzzle equal to or less than the standard time should be more satisfying. |
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| Sep-30-09 | | WhiteRook48: I got 38...Ne2+ 39 Rxe2 Rf1+ 40 Kh2 Rh8+ 41 Kg3 Bh4+ |
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| Sep-30-09 | | Athamas: A time limit would be nice, although I think people should still solve it to really improve their vision. Especially for the Friday, Saturday, and Sunday puzzles, I think a time limit would give you an idea of how well you're doing. |
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< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 3 OF 3 ·
Later Kibitzing> |
Kibitzing
sac: 38...Ne2+