chessgames.com
Members · Prefs · Laboratory · Collections · Openings · Endgames · Sacrifices · History · Search Kibitzing · Kibitzer's Café · Chessforums · Tournament Index · Players · Kibitzing
Dieter Pirrot vs Jonathan I M Grant
Bad Wiessee Open (2008), Bad Wiessee GER, rd 6, Nov-06
Caro-Kann Defense: Maroczy Variation (B12)  ·  1-0

ANALYSIS [x]

FEN COPIED

explore this opening
find similar games 366 more games of J Grant
PGN: download | view | print Help: general | java-troubleshooting

TIP: If you register a free account you will be able to create game collections and add games and notes to them. For more information on game collections, see our Help Page.

PGN Viewer:  What is this?
For help with this chess viewer, please see the Olga Chess Viewer Quickstart Guide.
PREMIUM MEMBERS CAN REQUEST COMPUTER ANALYSIS [more info]

Kibitzer's Corner
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 3 OF 3 ·  Later Kibitzing>
Sep-23-13
Premium Chessgames Member
  sorokahdeen: Good lord. What an opening!

The pawn offer on e4. Opening lines on the e-file by moving the same pawn for the second time in an opening where you have no pieces out and you've exchanged your DSB for a knight?

That was just weird.

Sep-23-13  patzer2: Sometimes the best way to refute a gambit is to accept it. In this case, instead of 7...e5? 8. Qxe4 , better for Black is 7...exf3 8. Nxf3 Nf6 = (position below).


click for larger view

White has more space, but is a pawn down and with isolated and doubled pawns which will be weak in an endgame. Black, with careful development and giving the pawn back at the right time, should equalize without too much difficulty.

For example, after 7...exf3 8. Nxf3 Nf6 9. Bg5 Nbd7 10. Qd2 h6 11. Bxf6 Nxf6 12. Bd3 c5! (position below)


click for larger view

13. O-O (13. dxc5 Qa5 14. c6 bxc6 15. O-O O-O ) 13... O-O 14. Rae1 b6 15. Qf4 Bb7 16. Ne5 Rc8 to (position below)


click for larger view

Black is in fine shape.

Sep-23-13  SicilianStar: Black should have won a pawn by taking on f3 on move 7 instead of losing a pawn with e5.
Sep-23-13  Gilmoy: <sorokahdeen: Opening lines on the e-file by moving the same pawn for the second time in an opening where you have no pieces out and you've exchanged your DSB for a knight?>

Black's opening wasn't all bad: he lured White's Q forward to take those pawns, then earns the tempi back by pecking at her. After <12...O-O-O 13.Qb4> Black is actually ahead in development.

Alas, the pawn structure is a permanent edge for White's Q-side attack. Caro-Kann <1..c6> and O-O-O elevates White's threat-of-Bf4 into an 8-point gorilla (e.g. 13..Qc7 14.Bf4 Qb6 drops a tempo). Presumably, this structural flaw motivates Black to castle short in C-K? Which in turn suggests that White saw deeper, and <10..Nbd7 11.Qd6!> is a nimble positional-sac-with-sting: White "sacs" an implied tempo to prevent O-O and make O-O-O irresistible ... the sting being that Black "castles into it". Who's kicking whom around!

Funny: White does actually have Ba6 for a potential Boden, hence Qxc6+ was a remote threat (if White ever gets a tempo to reposition his Q). Indirectly, this ties Black's Q down to defend c6 and/or forces Qs off.

As for the puzzle, the Bf4 gorilla creates a 3-deep b-wall, or <virtual rook>. So White has two "rooks", Black has a pawn: not yet a win. <18.Kf2> brings a 3rd rook, which is mate by force, per Anastasia. Usually it's a <rook> lift ...

Sep-23-13
Premium Chessgames Member
  ajk68: 18...h6? Not analyzing the threat. I'm a grandmaster of these types of blunders.
Sep-23-13  Once: <BOSTER> John Nunn invented the phrase "Loose Pieces Drop Off", sometimes shortened to LPDO.

Of course, this does not mean that every loose piece drops off, in all circumstances and regardless of who is to move. That would be tedious in the extreme.

It is a general guiding principle, a witty piece of guidance, a bon mot, a little nugget of gleaming wisdom in the dross of pedantry and whining that soils the modern age.

Of course, he could have written something that was a little more idiot-proof, such as "Loose pieces often fall off, depending on whose move it is and whether the opponent has sufficient threats to be able to take advantage of the aforementioned looseness of said pieces."

That might have saved him from the pettiness of the small-minded, but it would have been a less memorable and well-written aphorism.

<Once>, writing in the style of Nunn, writes "Stalemated kings get mated", trusting that at least some of our more erudite readers would spot the source quotation.

And the rest is best left to the imagination, for those that have one.

Sep-23-13
Premium Chessgames Member
  Penguincw: Another good way to start off the week. :)
Sep-23-13  MountainMatt: Rxa7!
Sep-23-13  patzer2: <After <12...O-O-O 13.Qb4> Black is actually ahead in development.> Not really! Black's a pawn down, and White with the open file and more pieces ready to attack the weak King position has a strong and nearly winning advantage.

However, I must admit the +2.32 advantage @ 18 depth Fritz gives after 13. Qb4 to seems a bit optimistic.

Sep-23-13  Returning Native: playground player: What in the world was the purpose of Black's 18...h6? Did he simply fail to see he was about to be mated

18...h6 makes reasonable sense if he wanted to avoid 19 Bxf6 Nxf6, drawing the N away from queenside defence duties. Perhaps he had personal problems distracting him.

We all make mistakes, sometimes at work, even 2200+ players.

Sep-23-13  patzer2: Perhaps 18...h6? was Black's way of quickly resigning a lost position against a strong master.

For example, if Black had instead played 18...a6, then 19. b5! cxb5 20. Bxb5 Rc8 21. c6! (position below)


click for larger view

gives White a crushing attack after 21...Nb8 22. c7 Nbd7 23. c4! Nh5 24. Rhb1 (+7.05 @ 21 depth per Fritz 12).

Sep-23-13  BOSTER: <Once> <writing in the style of Nunn>.

In his book "Secrets of Practical Chess" J.Nunn coined the phrase "Loose pieces Drop off" about the danger of loose pieces, they <tend> to drop off the board.

And this is correct.
But <stalemated kings> as usual <tend> to draw the game, but not <get mated>. Stalemate is considered a draw.

I know your love to create the new acronyms, but to invent them in chess you have to deeply understand chess. I know that your "analytical accuracy is not the be-all and end-all of good chess writing, and indeed often gets in the way of it".

Sep-23-13
Premium Chessgames Member
  FSR: It's easy to make fun of 22...h6 (I did too), but Houdini 3 says that Black is totally lost (north of +3) in any event. White has the bishop pair, his dark-squared bishop is an absolute monster, and there's no long-term defense against White's attack on the queen-side. As <patzer2> showed, 22...a6 loses to 23.b5. On 22...b5 (best, according to Houdini), 23.Ra6 Nb8 24.Bxb8 and 25.Rxc6 wins a pawn, and the b-pawn will fall next. Or 22...Nb8 23.c4 Rd8 24.Rhb1 Nd7 25.Bd6 preparing b5.
Sep-23-13
Premium Chessgames Member
  gawain: Black did not see the threat created by the innocuous-looking 18 Kf2. But his loss is our gain. A nice little puzzle.
Sep-23-13  HowDoesTheHorsieMove: It took me far too long to see the use of the other rook, but I eventually got there. I did notice the bishop move to delay the mate by one, though.
Sep-24-13  Abdel Irada: "Per'aps you 'ave reckoned without the small grey cells of Dieter Pirrot."

(With apologies to Agatha Christie.)

Sep-24-13  Abdel Irada: <kevin86: Could this one be called a maximummer? White made the longest move twice in a row.>

Well, maybe a quasi-maximummer (or, more accurately, a two-thirds maximummer). The third move (21. Rxa2#) is more nearly a minimummer.

Sep-24-13  Abdel Irada: <kramputz: To <Abdel Irada> Sara is a patriot. What are you ? Camel rider liberal. Leave politics out. I checked out your web site & profile they are terrible.>

If any of the above is not meant ironically, I can only say I'm sorry about your lobotomy.

Sep-24-13  Once: <BOSTER> I'll try to explain it as simply and slowly as I can. Here is the puzzle position...


click for larger view

Take a look at the black king sitting on a8. You will see that the king has no moves. He is blocked in by his own pawns on a7 and b7, and by the white bishop on f4.

We might coin the phrase that the <king> is stalemated. Note that we are not saying that the <position> is a stalemate. For that to happen, all of black's pieces would have to have no legal moves. That would indeed be a draw, if the player with the stalemated <position> could not make a legal move.

Accuracy, hmmm?

Stalemated kings are useful because they tell the attacking side that a mating net is nearly formed - an unanswerable check would be mate.

Stalemated kings are also useful because they tell the defending side that they are in danger. In this POTD, this ought to have alerted the player of the black pieces to look to his king's safety and not to play 18...h6.

Many of our easier puzzles which end in mate start with a king that is either stalemated or nearly stalemated.

This is how language and thinking evolve. Someone comes up with a new idea or a new term, like LPDO or "stalemated king" or GOOT. Sometimes these terms catch on, sometimes they don't. That's how the lexicon of something like chess matures and becomes more sophisticated.

You seem to have reverted to your old hobby of taking pot-shots at me ... and usually missing by miles. It's getting rather tiresome. Maybe it's time for a new hobby?

Sep-24-13  Abdel Irada: <You seem to have reverted to your old hobby of taking pot-shots at me ... and usually missing by miles. It's getting rather tiresome. Maybe it's time for a new hobby?>

Since they share a hobby (albeit with different targets), perhaps he should look up <JoergWalter> and they can practice their marksmanship on one another.

This would not only keep them usefully occupied, but it might, in time, improve their aim sufficiently that they won't inadvertently mow down entire fora with their misdirected sprays of verbal shrapnel.

Sep-24-13  Once: It is a sad fact of life that the internet tends to attract people who delight in criticism. I don't suppose that there is much we can do to change that, other than to hope that it is just a phase like adolescence and that they will grow out of it eventually.
Sep-24-13  Abdel Irada: <...hope that it is just a phase like adolescence and that they will grow out of it eventually>

It would be nice to think that, but such hopes are not supported by my experience. People of this kind keep pushing until they fall.

Of course, in your case, the motivation is easy to see: The "critics" don't believe they can do what you do so well, so their thoughts are twisted by envy.

Sep-24-13
Premium Chessgames Member
  perfidious: Good summation by <Abdel Irada> on the merit contained in the work of <Once>.

As to <Once>'s views on the adolescent phase, the internet seems to afford a golden opportunity for frequent regression to adolescence for many intelligent people, an event which is not at all likely to change any day soon.

Sep-25-13  Abdel Irada: <(Famous last words?)>

Since you have publicly requested the deletion of your account, should you not, in the name of consistency, hope they are?

Sep-25-13  Jim Bartle: <Once>: "It is a sad fact of life that the internet tends to attract people who delight in criticism..."

Ah, you're just completely wrong about that.

Jump to page #    (enter # from 1 to 3)
search thread:   
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 3 OF 3 ·  Later Kibitzing>

NOTE: Create an account today to post replies and access other powerful features which are available only to registered users. Becoming a member is free, anonymous, and takes less than 1 minute! If you already have a username, then simply login login under your username now to join the discussion.

Please observe our posting guidelines:

  1. No obscene, racist, sexist, or profane language.
  2. No spamming, advertising, duplicate, or gibberish posts.
  3. No vitriolic or systematic personal attacks against other members.
  4. Nothing in violation of United States law.
  5. No cyberstalking or malicious posting of negative or private information (doxing/doxxing) of members.
  6. No trolling.
  7. The use of "sock puppet" accounts to circumvent disciplinary action taken by moderators, create a false impression of consensus or support, or stage conversations, is prohibited.
  8. Do not degrade Chessgames or any of it's staff/volunteers.

Please try to maintain a semblance of civility at all times.

Blow the Whistle

See something that violates our rules? Blow the whistle and inform a moderator.


NOTE: Please keep all discussion on-topic. This forum is for this specific game only. To discuss chess or this site in general, visit the Kibitzer's Café.

Messages posted by Chessgames members do not necessarily represent the views of Chessgames.com, its employees, or sponsors.
All moderator actions taken are ultimately at the sole discretion of the administration.

This game is type: CLASSICAL. Please report incorrect or missing information by submitting a correction slip to help us improve the quality of our content.

Home | About | Login | Logout | F.A.Q. | Profile | Preferences | Premium Membership | Kibitzer's Café | Biographer's Bistro | New Kibitzing | Chessforums | Tournament Index | Player Directory | Notable Games | World Chess Championships | Opening Explorer | Guess the Move | Game Collections | ChessBookie Game | Chessgames Challenge | Store | Privacy Notice | Contact Us

Copyright 2001-2025, Chessgames Services LLC