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| Sep-08-12 | | mmousez: Why doesn't White play 17. d5, forking the Knight and Bishop? |
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Sep-08-12
 | | al wazir: I got the first three moves; but I think white had something better than 38. Ke2. How about this line: 38. Nd3, with the continuation 38...Rc3 39. Ke1 Rxd3 40. Qxd3 Ra1+ 41. Kd2 b2 42. Qb5! (threatening 43. Qxe8# as well as 43. Qxb2) b1=N+! |
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| Sep-08-12 | | Muztang: I guess it would go 17... Nb4, with a threat on the Bc2 (with possible nasty forks and an annoying Nd3 if queens are exchanged on d1), kind of equivalent to the threat on the Be6. That would explain why White played 17. a3, wouldn't it? |
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| Sep-08-12 | | Muztang: @ al wazir: in your line, how would you answer 39. Qb2? |
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| Sep-08-12 | | sevenseaman: The position is ripe for some hot exchanges. The only misgiving that crossed my mind was that Black may not be able to extract an eye for an eye even though he may end up more than level in the material/positional aspects. First 2 moves are automatic, so to say.
34...Bxc4 35. Rxb3 axb3 (he loses more if he goes for the Q, so should be happy with a passed P.) 36. Qb1 Bxf1+ 37. Kxf1 (must) Rxa3 And Black is well-placed to push his very advanced P. If I am not entirely off my rocker, for a change a Saturday puzzles goes the way everyone would like to play OTB. I will, definitely. |
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| Sep-08-12 | | dick50: Black Queen is trapped and safe return is unlikely hence the immediate objective is to extract maximum in return for the Queen. Trading of Queen for Rook on c3 and Knight on c4 is probably the best bargain. c3 and b3 are two sites for exchange of Queen for Rook. Exchange on b3 is preferable as a pawn on brings a pawn (now on b file) is a passer. So 34 ...Bxc4 35 Rxb3
Two options on next move
a) 35 ...Bxe3 36 Rxe3 R(a8)b8
b) 35 ...axb3 36 Q ~ Bxf1 37 Kxf1 Rxa3
Option a) restores material parity. Immediate threats from black have vanished, but two open files belong to Black Rooks. Black should win after some middle game struggle and decisive endgame advantage. Option b) is more aggressive in comparison. Black has Two Rooks and a pawn for the Queen. Black has two Rooks on open files, facilitating advance of b pawn, against White Queen and Knight. This should be sufficient for settling the matter quickly. |
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Sep-08-12
| | al wazir: <Muztang: how would you answer 39. Qb2?> You're right, that would be better for white. But that just strengthens the case for 38. Nd3. |
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Sep-08-12
 | | tarek1: The black queen is attacked so Black's options are limited.
He could play <34...Qa2+> but after <35.Rf2 Qa1 36.Nc2 Qb1>
I don't see a win for Black.
More promising is <34...Bxc4!>After <35.Rxb3> forced, (Rxc4 loses a rook) instead of the conventional <35...Bxd3 36.Rxd3>
Black can give his queen for 2 rooks by
<35..axb3 36.Qb1>
or 36.Qd2 for example, <36...Bxf1+ 37.Kxf1 Rxa3> 
click for larger viewBlack should be winning here, the b-pawn and the weakness of white's king should decide.
In this position <38.Qb2> is the only move because Black threaten Rb8 followed by Ra2, b2, Ra1. The white queen can't move because of either Rb8 or Ra2,
the knight can't go very far, because of Ra1+ and Ra2 pinning the queen,
and the white king can't go to the 2d rank because of the same pin.
Black is going to develop his knight, put his king on e7 while White is basically in zugzwang. This isn't a clear-cut win but I don't see anything better and I don't see how can white save this. |
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| Sep-08-12 | | Abulherar: The solution is:34...Bxc4! 35.Rxb3 axb3!
Now,I think that white should resign Because:36.Qb1 Bxf1+ 37.Kxf1
as you can see:Black has passed pawn on the b-file,which will lead white to lose the game. |
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| Sep-08-12 | | LoveThatJoker: <34...Bxc4! 35. Rxb3> (35. Rxc4?/Qxc4? Qxc4  )
<35...axb3 36. Qd2/Qd1/Qb1 Bxf1+ 37. Kxf1 Rxa3> Black has an excellent extra pawn on b3; also, along with the promotion threat, he has various potential threats along the 1st and 2nd ranks, especially after the Rooks are doubled (e.g., ...Rca8). LTJ |
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| Sep-08-12 | | newzild: <al wazir> I don't think your line helps White. After 38. Nd3, Black plays 38...b2. a) 39. Qxb2 Rxd3 +
b) 39. Nxb2 Rb3 (threat 40. Rcb8) 40. Qa1 Rcb8 +
c) 39. Ke2 Rb8 (intending 40. Ra8) 40. Nxb2 R3b3 + |
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Sep-08-12
 | | FSR: 34...Bxc4 35.Rxb3 (35.Rxc4 Rxc4) axb3! 36.Qd2 Bxf1+ 37.Kxf1 Rxa3 must win for Black. Black has two rooks for a queen, and the passed b-pawn is a monster. |
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| Sep-08-12 | | Razgriz: Saw 34. ... Bxc4 35. Rxb3 Bxd3 but then again that's the wrong continuation. Very well played by black here. |
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| Sep-08-12 | | M.Hassan: "Very Difficult"
Black to play 34...?
Black is a pawn up
Got help from Chessmaster and was given the following line: 34.............Bxc4
35.Rxb3 axb3
(I would not have ever thought of axb3 over the table!)
36.Qd2 Bxf1
37.Kxf1 Rxa3
38.Qb2 Rca8
39.h4 Kf8
40.h5 R8a4
41.Qc3 Rxe4
42.Qb2 Ra4
Black can now get the Knight out, he has pawn majority and his doubled Rooks can handle the White Queen |
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| Sep-08-12 | | TheBish: T Gvarjaladze vs V Vepkhvishvili, 1998 Black to play (34...?) "Very Difficult", even material. If I have it right, the first few moves for Black are "easy". Maybe the difficulty lies ahead, converting the small material advantage, but it looks fairly easy to me, more like a "medium/difficult". 34...Bxc4! 35. Rxb3
Forced, as anything else loses material. Now 35...Bxd3 36. Rxd3 would be equal, but Black has better. 35...axb3!
The most difficult part of the puzzle, seeing that you could give up the queen for a net gain of material. Instead of winning the queen back (for a bishop, gaining 6 points), Black gets both rooks and a pawn for the bishop, which is not only two points more, but it creates a passed pawn which should be the difference maker. 36. Qd2 Bxf1+ 37. Kxf1 Rxa3 38. Qb2 Rb8!!
This was the hardest part for me to find (and I'm starting to rethink my assessment of the difficult level, maybe it's accurate after all). If not for this move, the win would be problematic, trying to coordinate the rooks without giving up the passed pawn. 39. Nd3
If 39. Qxa3 b2, and after the pawn queens Black will be up a rook. 39...Ra2 40. Qc3 Rc2! 41. Qe1
Black's knight nicely prevents Qc7, which could have been problematic if the knight were absent. 41...b2 42. Nxb2 (forced) Rcxb2 43. Qc3 Ra2 44. Qd3 Rbb2 45. Qd1 Rh2 46. Kg1 Rag2+ 47. Kf1 Rh1+ 48. Kxg2 Rxd1 Of course, there is probably a better defense at the end, but this seems to illustrate the strength of Black's position. |
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| Sep-08-12 | | rilkefan: Tried to make ...Qxc3 work clearly, but couldn't. (Stockfish says that 34...Qxc3 35.Qxc3 Bxc4 36.Qb4 Bxf1+ 37. Kxf1 is -1.5.) Then I saw that ...Bxc4 had all the same virtues and more, like a passed b pawn. |
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| Sep-08-12 | | lost in space: Thought about 34...Bxc4 but was not able to make the line work. In very much underestimated the power of black's (new) b-pawn! (after axb3) |
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| Sep-08-12 | | cyclon: I'd suggest (relatively simple) 34. -Bxc4 35. Rxb3 (practically the only move - 34. Rxc4 Rxc4 is tantamount to resignation) 35. -axb3 36. Qd1/b1 Bxf1+ 37. Kxf1 Rxa3, and in my estimation Black's got a winning game due to passed b-pawn and active Rook-pair with promotion - plus Queen-trapping threats on the back-ranks. |
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| Sep-08-12 | | Abdel Irada: <The two towers and the fellowship of the pawn> Black obtains two rooks and an advanced passed pawn for his queen with <34. ...♗xc4!>; however, I cannot claim the felicity of being able to prove a win. Play might continue: 35. ♖xb3...
(If 35. ♖xc4?, ♕xc4  with an exchange plus for Black. If 35. ♕xc4?, ♕xc3 , again with an exchange up for Black.) 35. ...axb3!
This is much more promising than restoring material parity with 35. ...♗xd3; 36. ♖xd3 =, when Black has no particular advantage. 36. ♕d2!...
The most flexible and aggressive square for the queen, as will become apparent. 36. ...♗xf1†
Here it might also be worth considering declining the exchange with 36. ...♖xa3?!, but I see no good continuation after 37. ♖f2, ♖a2; 38. ♕b4!. 37. ♔xf1, ♖xa3
38. ♕b4!, ♖ca8  .
As I suggested above, Black probably stands better in principle, but to convert that theoretical advantage into a real win will demand far more thought than reaching this position in the first place. |
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| Sep-08-12 | | cyclon: <TheBish:> Into your < 38. -Rb8!! ( exlamation marks YOURS, 38. -Rca8 A-L-S-O wins ) 39. Nd3 Ra2 40. Qc3 > suggested 40. -Rc2 I'd play INSTEAD immediately 40. -b2. No computer used, check it if it works. It should go without saying that Black has to continue with accuracy here. I don't see any saving plan or tactics for White if Black plays correctly. |
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| Sep-08-12 | | cyclon: For example ( after 37. -Rxa3 38. Qb2 ) 38. -Rca8 and if now 39. Qc3, then -Rb8 winning a tempo in case of 40. Nd3/Nf3 (Nc2 bxc2 and if 41. Qxa3 [Qxc2 Rxe3 and Black gradually wins] -Rb1+ over) 41. b2 and as far as I can see it's over. Then, if 39. Nd3 comes -Ra1+ 40. Ne1 (Nc1 R8a2 41. Qc3 and only NOW -Rc2 'fixing' the curtains) -Rd1 41. Qxb3 (Ke2 Ra2) -Raa8 winning the Knight and the game gradually by playing relatively correctly. I-F White plays (38. -Rca8) 39. h4, then Black moves 'quietly' 39. -g6 Zugzwanging White and planning -Ng7-Nh5-Ng3-Nxe4. These are the reasons why 35. -means pretty much 'cufflinks'. |
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| Sep-08-12 | | Abdel Irada: <On East 57th Thought>: Further, more leisurely examination leads me to an improvement for Black in my analysis above: <38. ...♖a1!>. (1) If White takes the pawn, Black plays 39. ...♖8c1, winning the knight. (2) If White tries to break the pin with 39. ♔e2/♔f2, Black has the surprise shot 39. ...♖c2†!, when if White captures with the knight, he can't stop the pawn. (2.1) 40. ♔f3 is met with 40. ...b2! and again the pawn cannot be stopped. (2.2) 40. ♔d3? loses horribly to 40. ...♖d1†, with mate to follow on the next move. And finally, any attempt to counterpin Black's knight comes to nothing after the simple ...♔f8. All of this means that the queen has to go to b2 after all, allowing ...♖b8 with a winning advantage. In this line, White can't bring out his king or knight without facing dangerous tactical shots on the second rank, while Black is free to improve his position at leisure and finally bring the knight around to eject the queen. |
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| Sep-08-12 | | DarthStapler: Got it |
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| Sep-08-12 | | morfishine: Good through 34...Bxc4 35.Rxb3 axb3 36.Qb1
Not so good is <36...Rxa3> instead of the surgical and much better 36...Bxf1 |
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| Sep-08-12 | | johnlspouge: < <Abdel Irada> wrote: [snip] Black obtains two rooks and an advanced passed pawn for his queen with <34. ...Bxc4!>; however, I cannot claim the felicity of being able to prove a win. [snip] > When I started playing chess seriously, I had the following stripped-down position with White against Paul Brown. 
click for larger viewI had captured on d5 to get a passed P. Paul played a nice combination, which was at the edge of my comprehension at the time: [1]...Nb3 [2] axb3 Rxa1 [3] Rxa1
Nigel Fullbrook happened to pass by and saw the combination. Paul exclaimed exultantly, "Nigel, look as this!". After the combination had been played, Nigel remarked drily, "Too bad it loses," and sauntered away. There is more than point count (Q=9=R+N+P) to chess: Nigel knew it, but Paul and I were less aware. I was amazed at how fast Paul's game fell apart, but <I> was the one with an extra piece to help push my passed d-pawn, and the P became unstoppable. Needless to say, <FSR>'s analysis < <FSR> wrote: 34...Bxc4 35.Rxb3 (35.Rxc4 Rxc4) axb3! 36.Qd2 Bxf1+ 37.Kxf1 Rxa3 must win for Black. Black has two rooks for a queen, and the passed b-pawn is a monster. > was as far as I needed to calculate, beyond the fact that the passed b-pawn survives to become a strategic issue. |
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Kibitzing
sac: 34...Bxc4
