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< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 3 OF 3 ·
Later Kibitzing> |
Nov-13-03
 | | Chessical: <Open Defence> Do you mean soemthiong like: 19.Ndf5 gxf5 20.Nxf5 Rc2
then - 21.Qxh5
I can only see a draw here e.g.
21...Rxf2 22.Qg4+ Kh7 23.Qh5+ Kg8 24.Kxf2 Ne5 25.Nh6+ Kg7 26.Nf5+ |
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Nov-13-03
 | | Open Defence: what about 22Re3 ..... |
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Nov-13-03
| | Open Defence: I think you probably had the reply Rxg2+ in mind ...but since the e3 rook still defends the e pawn for the time being i think Rxg2+ should not be dangerous and White can play Kxg2 ... hope im not blundering |
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Nov-13-03
| | Chessical: <Open Defence> White needs his N on f5 for checks on h6 and to hit d6 or f7 in the above lines. After 19.Ndf5 gxf5 20.Nxf5 Rc2 21.Qxh5 Rxf2 22.<Re3> Black can sac the exchange on f5, and White's attack seems to lose all its main-spring. e.g.: 22...Rxf5 23.Rg3+ Bg7 24.Qxf5 Ne5 and Black has three minor pieces for a R and a P and no good line I can see. |
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Nov-13-03
| | Open Defence: hmmm i overlooked the Rxf5 hehehehehhehehe so I am dumb! hahahahahahaha hmmm so there are many resources in this position.. any way and what about 22Nh6+ after Rxf2 ....that should keep the knight... |
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Nov-13-03
| | Chessical: <Open Defence> After 19.Ndf5 gxf5 20.Nxf5 Rc2 21.Qxh5 Rxf2 22.Nh6 Kg7 is forced. So: 22.Nh6+ Kg7 23.Qg4+ Kh7 24.Kxf2 Ne5 25.Qh5 Kg7 26.Nf5+ Kg8 27.Nh6+ Kg7 28.Nf5+ with a draw. Perhaps 23.Kf2 is better? Unfortunately, I am now out of time (and ideas) for today. I look forward to what other kibitzers will suggest. |
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Nov-13-03
| | Open Defence: after 22..Kg7 how about 23Re3... |
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| Nov-13-03 | | AdrianP: <All> This is getting interesting...! 19. Ndf5 gxf5 20. Nxf5
<AP Line 1>
(a) 20 ... Rxc2
(i) 21. Qxc2 is anybody's game: material's approximately even (B has two pieces for a pawn and R), Bs king's exposed and W pieces are more active, I'd say "+=". There are no particular forcing lines.
(ii) 21. Qxh5 ... 21. Rxf2!? (is a lovely idea, W cannot allow Rxf5 after which W is just losing see <Chessical> above) 22. Kxf2 is level(ish) or 21. ... Rc5 (same idea) or even 21 ...Rxc1 all look fine but 21 ...Bg7? 22. Qg4! and W is winning. <AP Line 2>
(b) 20 ... Ne5
(i) 21. Qxh5 Re8 (anything else allows W a draw by perpetual) 22. Re3 (22. Nh6+? Kf8) Ng6 (22. Rxc2?! Rg3+ 23. Ng6 (forced) 24. Rxg6+!? fxg6 25. Qxg6 Kh8 (otherwise mate) and W has at least a perpetual but I can't see anything more) 23. Rg3 Qd7 (to defend laterally after the exchange sac on g6) and W cannot break through. <AP Line 3>
(c) 20... Re8 (my original suggestion, which I like less, now, the main idea being to free f8 for the K...)
(i) 21. Qxh5 Ne5 transposes to line b(i) above
(ii) 21. Nxd6 Re7 Nxc8 is going to be level(ish)
Phew, that's probably the longest post I've ever submitted... and it's probably all wrong anyway !? Maybe <Honza> or <Crafty> will put us out of our misery...! |
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Nov-13-03
| | Chessical: <Open Defence> 19.Ndf5 gxf5 20.Nxf5 Rxc2 21.Qxh5 Rxf2 22.Nh6+ Kg7 then 23.Re3 is refuted by 23...Bh4! (blocking the R's entry point) 24.Rf3 Bxe4 25.Rxf2 Bxf2+ 26.Kxf2 Qf6+ 27.Kg1 Qg6 winning <AdrianP> Thank you for your detailed contribution. In line AP 2 I have tried but failed to find a winning line: 19.Ndf5 gxf5 20.Nxf5 Ne5 21.Qxh5 Re8 22.Re3 Ng6 23.Rg3 <Qd7> "and W cannot break through" - AdrianP; 24.Nh6+ Kf8 25.Nf5 <Rxc2!?> 26.Bh6+ Kg8 27.Rxg6+ fxg6 28.Qxg6+ Kh8 29.Qxf6+ Kh7 30.Be3 and Black is still in the game Or <25...R(e)d8> 26.Bd3 Qe6 27.Qh6+ Ke8 28.Ng7+ Bxg7 Qxg7 with White having a B and 2 P's for 2 N's. |
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Nov-14-03
| | Open Defence: Its funny how you started out finding a winning line for White and I was trying to save it for Black, now the roles are reversed hehehehe, very dynamic position :-) |
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Nov-14-03
| | Open Defence: are you sure that after 19.Ndf5 gxf5 20.Nxf5 Rxc2 21.Qxh5 Rxf2 22.Nh6+ Kg7 23Re3 Bh4 24Nf5+ Rxf5 (otherwise the h4 bishop goes and Rg3 is possible) 25Bh6+ that Black can defend ? |
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Nov-14-03
| | Chessical: <Open Defence> In your line the White Re3 blocks you from playing 25.Bh6. |
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Nov-15-03
| | Open Defence: my kingdom for virtual machine hehehehehehhe, sheesh this game has given me the maximum chance to blunder hehehehe, anyway ... thinkin about the position again and again....I can't help feeling that maybe we have overlooked a transposition... mainly in the line after 23..Bh4 ... I have taken the moves down, lets see if I can find anything at home hehehe |
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Nov-15-03
| | Open Defence: ok going by my tendency to post ridiculuous lines .. here is another attempt.... is 19.Ndf5 gxf5 20.Nxf5 Rxc2 21.Qxh5 Rxf2 22Kxf2 losing for White ? |
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Nov-15-03
| | Chessical: <Open Defence> After 19.Ndf5 gxf5 20.Nxf5 Rxc2 21.Qxh5 Rxf2 <22.Kxf2> Ne5 23.Re3 (23.Rd1 Nac4 24.b3 Ng6!) 23...Ng6 24.Rg3 Qc7 25.Nh6+ Kg7 26.Nf5+ White does not appear to have established any advantage. |
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Nov-18-03
| | Open Defence: ok here is another ridiculuous idea before Chessical murders me ..
19.Ndf5 gxf5 20.Nxf5 Rxc2 21.Qxh5 Rxf2 22.Nh6+ Kg7 23.Re3 Bh4 24.Rh3 .. how about that ? |
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| Nov-18-03 | | ughaibu: The main problem is you'd have to take your own pawn. |
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Nov-19-03
| | Open Defence: lol ughaibu.. the pawn is on h3!! hahahaha sheesh, no more analysis without a board.. it makes me look dumb!!! hehehehe |
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Nov-19-03
| | Open Defence: any thoughts on a possibility of White favorably transposing moves ughaibu? |
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Nov-19-03
| | Open Defence: <ughaibu> <Chessical> Okay lets see if I can get a decent line without taking one of my own pieces or making a bigger fool of my self - <19.Ndf5 gxf5 20.Nxf5 Rxc2 21.Qxh5 Rxf2 22.Kxf2 Ne5 23.Re3 Ng6 24.Rg3 Qc7 25.Nh6+ Kg7> now how about 26.Nxf7 followed by Bh6+ ? |
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Nov-19-03
| | Chessical: <Open Defence> 19.Ndf5 gxf5 20.Nxf5 Rxc2 21.Qxh5 Rxf2 22.Kxf2 Ne5 23.Re3 Ng6 24.Rg3 Qc7 25.Nh6+ Kg7 <26.Nxf7!?> 26...Bxe4! Supporting the N, (26...Kxf7 27.Qh7+ [seems strong but...] Ke6 28.Qxc7 Bd8+! and White's attack is at an end) 27.Bh6+ Kxf7 28.Bxf8 Kxf8 29.Qh6+ Bg7 and Black is winning. |
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Nov-20-03
| | Open Defence: what about 26..Kxf7 27.Rxf7 or in response to Bxe4 27.Bh6+ Kxf7 28.Qh7+ (I don't have the board up but I think the g6 knight blocks the e4 bishop so Qh7+ is possible) I don't think White should play Bxf8 exchanging an attacking piece that can control the dark squares around the black king.. what a position!! immensely complicated!! |
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Nov-20-03
| | Chessical: <Open Defence>: From 19.Ndf5 gxf5 20.Nxf5 Rxc2 21.Qxh5 Rxf2 22.Kxf2 Ne5 23.Re3 Ng6 24.Rg3 Qc7 25.Nh6+ Kg7 26.Nxf7? <Kxf7!?> (a) 27.Rxf7? - the rook is on g3 so this is impossible or
(b) 27.Qh7+ Ke6 28.Qxg6?! Qc2+! 29.Kg1
Bxe4 30.Qg4+ Bf5 which is better for Black, <but>: (c) Please note that after
26.Nxf7!? Bxe4! (which I believe is stronger than 26....Kxf7!?) 27.Bh6+ Kxf7 - the White Q cannot get to h7 to deliver check as she is blocked by the White Bishop on h6. |
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| Sep-27-09 | | notyetagm: Wow! What a game by Stein! |
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| Aug-29-12 | | Capacorn: What a brilliant combination beginning with 31...Qxb6!! Stein had to have seen the follow-up, 33...Rxa4!, the ensuing mating threats to the white king and the futility of white’s ensuing checks in order to go in for the idea. A wonderful conception by Leonid. The score to the game I have comes from Keene’s book, “Leonid Stein: Master of Attack.” Keene has Lutikov resigning after 40...Nf2. Nonetheless, he points out that white runs out of checks after 41.Qd8+, Kxe6 42.Qe8+, Kf6 43.Qh8+, Kf5 44.Qc8+, Kg5 45.Qd8+, Kh6 46.Rg1, Ng4+. Keene’s analysis stops here, but the final move given signals the start of a forced mating combination: 47.hxg4, Rb2+ 48.Rg2, Rxg2+ 49.Kh1, Rxg3+ 50.Kh2, Rxg4+ 51.Kh3, Bg2#. (My own notes.) |
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Kibitzing
sac: 31...Qxb6