Feels like the same subject to me. You found a source and drew already a conclusion, but I cannot see any verification.

Academical historians use many categories of sources to avoid mistakes. Here is an example from chess history that illustrates the dangers of family sources: http://www.chessarch.com/archive/00....

The NYH article belongs to those sources, which German historians call 'ex post' (I don't know, if this term is used in English, too), like many obituaries. James Mortimer's reminiscences are written decades later, too, and they seem to be quite anecdotical.

I'm a little confused about your cautions. Not the last one so much, as I haven't researched it, but your first advisement.

I've read it before, but any excuse for a re-reading is a good excuse. However, consider the imperative at the end:

"The conclusion I would like to present to chess biographers is this: <Do not limit the range of research to old chess columns and chess periodicals>. We have to look for confirmation of the “facts” in non-chess related literature and in the record offices, or archives, of schools, universities, churches, cemeteries and hospitals."

An obituary in a general circulation newpaper, such as the New York Herald, is not a chess periodical, nor exactly a chess column. As a non-professional, I certainly will never have access to the other records referred to.

<Feels like the same subject to me. You found a source and drew already a conclusion, but I cannot see any verification.>

What exactly you are referring to here isn't exactly clear to me. I posted two quotes, one from Winter the other from the NY Herald, so some further specification would be helpful. And it's inconclusive which conclusion is being called into question.

I'm a little on a defensive footing without knowing what exactly is in need of defending.

But I know that you were observing Lent, let's rejoin the discussion next week. I have an hypothesis of events which seems to fit all the known record (ie known to me). It would be interesting to have you critique it.

The essence is contained here:

http://www.chesshistory.com/winter/...

It's Winter's treatment of the infamous Steinitz-Blackburne "dust-up".

(I should look up the German word for "dust-up"... not there, but "fight" is = kampfen, fechten, sich schlagen)

Winter shows how the story can become distorted in contemporary (i.e. modern) retelling.

But even more critical is the fact that the story may be confused from its very inception. The point is that even the contemporaneous sources can be in conflict, and contain truths and almost truths, even if retold by the very participants who are the only people who can recount the story, but who find it next to impossible to recount unbiasedly, even if given time to gain some distance and perspective on the event of interest.

With Kolisch we may have some parallels in both the telling and retelling of his challenge to Morphy.

OK then, here are the auxiliary links to fill out Winter's treatment:

<CN 6437>
http://www.chesshistory.com/winter/...

Maybe batgirl has been following our discussion here? She cites the <Daily Alta> article I ref'ed above:

Kolisch had changed his profession some times, before he rose from destitute beginnings to distinguished riches. The highlight of his chess career was the win of the Napoleon prize at Paris (1867). In later years, Kolisch became a banker and estate owner. He acquired the <Freiherrntitel> (Baron) in Sachsen-Meiningen. He bought land on the Kahlenberg and arranged beautiful parties in the gloriously renovated, former Villa Felix. He was an honorary member of the Vienna Chess Society. For a long time its vice-president, then for two years its president, and then committee member. He was also a publisher, first with the fiscal 'Grüne Blätter', which crashed fast. Later, he became the publisher of the 'Wiener Allgemeine Zeitung', ruining his health and after a financial loss of almost half a million, he put it aside (maybe he stopped publishing it) on 21 October 1888. His widow and his brother, the well-known paediatrician Dr. Emanuel Kolisch, mourn his death.

Curious about the exact nature of the publication that "ruin[ed] his health", I found this:

<The Wiener Allgemeine Zeitung (WAZ) was published from 1 March 1880 to 11 February 1934 to the Vienna daily liberal direction. It was founded by Theodor Hertzka that led to 1886 as editor, as long Editors acted inter alia 1899-1909 Julius Szeps and from 1927 to 1934, the Social Democrat Paul German . For the WAZ wrote inter alia Jakob Julius David , Milan Dubrovic , the screenwriter Paul Frank , Géza Herczeg , Robert Hirschfeld , Max Kalbeck , Ignaz von Kolisch , Carl Lafite , Emil Marriot , Alfred Polgar , Richard Specht , Elizabeth Thury , Berta Zuckerkandl and music critic Gustav Doempke . Hugo von Hofmannsthal published in the daily early poetry, for example, in the issue of December 25, 1896 the love poem "The Two". [1]

As an additional title was initially "Six-clock-sheet", later "Late Evening Journal" out. The publication changed. To 20 December 1888, the Wiener Allgemeine Zeitung appeared as a morning paper, midday leaf and six o'clock evening sheet, then in the evening on weekdays. Throughout its existence, the newspaper changed hands several times the size. Appeared originally in the format 41 x 26.4 cm, so 28 cm was changed from 1915 to 41 x.

In the wake of the uprising in February 1934, the Wiener Allgemeine Zeitung had to cease publication. >

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wiener...

A few later years of the publication (post-Kolisch) may be available here:

http://anno.onb.ac.at/cgi-content/a...

also see

< Ignatz von Kolisch
Was Slovakian, not Polish.
Like Sir Jeremy Morse
He made a fortune at the Bourse.>

I was happy to see that that superb clerihew was included in the startling opus titled:

<"Ignaz Kolisch, The Life and Chess Career of that Mental Midget by Fabrizio Zavatarelli Which Has Been Granted the ISB number of 978-0-7864-9690-7, Or, In a Truncated Format, ISBN: 978-1-4766-1801-2, Which Consisteth It of 324 games, 174 Diagrams and 63 Illustrations, (with various appendices, notes, bibliography, indexes and all them ting, amounting to a <rastafari> 376 pages>".

<"... Why Kolisch, or in fact any of the other of the noted European masters, did not see fit to accept Morphy's den (?) is a mere matter of conjecture, scarely pertinent to the case, although it would be impossible to find any one who had ever played with Morphy who was not convinced that he was a class above the players of modern times">>

I should have guessed that one... but a den of Morphy was too attractive a concept.

* * * * *

Q- Why does <CG> insist on the seemingly unnecessary "von" in his name?

The esteemed, and perhaps most accurate book ever by Zavatarelli simply gives his name as

<Ignatz Kolisch>.

Us Z's gotta stick together. As do us Ignatz's...

<Ignaz Kolisch>

The "z" remains, but the "t" goes. Why?

1) Zavatarelli's authoritative biography of Kolisch uses that name.

http://www.amazon.com/Ignaz-Kolisch...

2) The contemporaneous press used <Ignaz> as well, and he even used it in his own signature:

https://books.google.com/books?id=U...

(did he write that in English?)

3) His descendents use that name:

https://www.chess.com/article/view/... (see first comment)

4) There's also this...

http://www.kwabc.org/index.php/ches...

Which I think pretty definitely eliminates both the "von" and the "t".

BTW- can anybody make out what I presume is the middle name?

.

London, England, Church of England Marriages and Banns, 1754-1921: <Ignaz Baron Kolisch>

<London, England, Crisp's Marriage Licence Index, 1713-1892: <Ignaz Baron Kolisch>

Germany & Austria, Directories of Military and Marine Officers, 1600-1918: <Ignaz Kolisch>

JewishGen Online Worldwide Burial Registry: <Dr. Ignaz Kolisch>

He was born in Pressburg, Slovakia. Slovakian website http://www.sachovespravy.eu/jan2006... has <Ignaz von Kolisch> and <Ignaz Kolisch> (but also d. 1879).

He played a series of matches against various British players at the St. Georges Chess Club:

<K -- Sobouroff 6-0-0 (N odds)>

<K -- Worrall 6-2-0 (N odds)>

<K -- Maude 3-3-1 (N odds (but Maude had to win 6/9))>

<Ignaz Kolisch> and not 'Ignatz von' see <Tabanus'> post: Ignatz von Kolisch

'Ignaz Kolisch' (proper DB name),
later 'Ignaz von Kolisch'

for comparison see

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurt_...

His paper

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wiene...

His title (acquired for 36.700 Mark)

'.. Der am 8. April 1837 in Preßburg geborene Ignaz Kolisch, Realitätenbesitzer [real estate owner] auf dem Kahlenberge bei Wien, Banquier und Herausgeber der Wiener "Allgemeinen Zeitung", erhielt ddo. [de dato] 14. April 1881 den herzoglich sachsen-meiningischen Freiherrnstand. Derselbe, welcher ungarischer Unterthan war, wurde ohne vorherige Erlaubnis des Kaisers vom Herzoge geadelt und baronirt, weshalb ihm die Erlaubnis zur Annahme dieses Titels in der österreichisch-ungarischen Monarchie verweigert wurde. Er trat nun ddo. Budapest, 19. Juli 1884 aus dem ungarischen Staatsverbande und wurde ddr. Meiningen 26. Juli 1884 herzoglich sachsen-meiningischer Staatsangehöriger. Als fremder Unterthan konnte er nun doch in Österreich-Ungarn den Baronstitel führen. ..'

from 'Geadelte jüdische Familien', Verlag Kyffhäuser, 1891

An interesting question (considering 'Adoptivkinder') arose after Ignaz died

'Anfrage der Witwe Irma Freifrau von Kolisch nach der Möglichkeit der Weitergabe der Nobilitierung an Adoptivkinder.'

https://www.archive-in-thueringen.d...

His pseudonym and more

https://www.chess-international.com...

https://glarean-magazin.ch/2020/09/...

Bigger picture

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nobil...

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adels...

(all in German)

Unrelated

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AZy...