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| Jan-25-18 | | areknames: Only spent a few moments analyzing, so I only got the first move then nada. In retrospect it wasn't all that hard to calculate the winning combination. More importantly, I love how black defended perfectly against the Alapin and was quick to punish 20.Qe4? |
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| Jan-25-18 | | mel gibson: I predicted 20...Nxd4.
Stockfish 8 says:
(20. .. Nxd4
(♘c6xd4 ♕e4-b1 ♘d4xf3+ ♘e1xf3 ♖c8xc1 ♖d1xc1 ♕d7-a4
b4-b5 ♕a4xa3 ♕b1-c2 h7-h6 h2-h3 ♖d8-d3 ♖c1-b1 ♗b7-d5 ♘f3-e1 ♖d3-c3 ♕c2-d1
♖c3-c4 ♘e1-f3 ♕a3-a4 ♕d1-f1 ♖c4-c2 ♕f1-d1 ♕a4-c4 ♘f3-d2 ♕c4-d3 ♘d2-f3
♕d3xd1+ ♖b1xd1 ♗d5xf3 g2xf3 ♖c2-b2 ♖d1-d7 ♖b2xb5 ♖d7xa7 ♖b5-b1+ ♔g1-g2
b6-b5 ♖a7-b7 b5-b4 f3-f4 b4-b3 ♔g2-f3 b3-b2 ♔f3-e2 ♔g8-h7) +3.02/35 94) score for Black +3.02 depth 35 |
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Jan-25-18
 | | Richard Taylor: I found this as played, but was wondering idly if the 2...Ne2+ as -- <chess higher cat> also considered -- might be better but it looked too complex and resorted to the original plan as being clearer. In fact it doesn't work as when one takes the R on c1 it doesn't pin the R on d1 so this is the line that results:
20...Nxd4 21. Qxb7 Ne2+? 22. Kf1 Qxb7
23. Bxb7 Rxc1 24. Rxd8+ Bxd8 25. Kxe2 with probably a winning advantage. |
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| Jan-25-18 | | patzer2: For today's Thursday puzzle (20...?), 20...Nxd4! was an easy first move choice -- a move begging to be played. However, after the expected 20...Nxd4! 21. Qxb7, I chose 21...Ne2+ -+ (-3.61 @ 34 ply, Stockfish 8) instead of the game continuation 21...Qxb7 -+ (-3.83 @ 34 ply, Stockfish 8). Stockfish 8 gives this 21...Ne2+ alternative winning line as 21...Ne2+ 22.Kf1 Qxb7 23.Bxb7 Nxc1 24.Rxd8+ Rxd8 25.Bxc1 Rd1 26.Ke2 Rxc1 -+ (-4.02 @ 33 ply). P.S.: White's decisive mistake was 20. Qe4?, allowing our puzzle solution 20...Nxd4! -+. Instead, White could have held it near level with 20. Qb5 Kf8 21. Rc2 Ne2 22. Qxd7 Rxd7 23. Rxc8+ Bxc8+ 24. Be4 Bb7 25. Bxb7 Rxb7 26. Rc1 Ne5 ⩱ (-0.41 @ 35 ply, Stockfish 8). Early in this Sicilian Alapain (B22), our Opening Explorer indicates that instead of the computer pick 8. Be3 =, White has had more success with the second most popular human move 8. Ne5 as in the draw in X Bedouin vs D Swiercz, 2013. The most popular move is 8. c4 = as in the draw in A Riazantsev vs N Vitiugov, 2016. |
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Jan-25-18
| | Richard Taylor: But it depends on the move order. It seems that 21. ... Ne2 is also correct, I misread the -2.97 (on Stockfish) as indicating a plus for White. A case where the move order seems not to matter. Sometimes it does. |
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| Jan-25-18 | | saturn2: Me too had the internediate check 21..Ne2+ |
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| Jan-25-18 | | cocker: In the final position White can play 25 Bxc1, but Black recovers the piece with 25 ... Rd1. Still a premature resignation by my standards. |
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| Jan-25-18 | | mel gibson: < cocker: In the final position White can play 25 Bxc1, but Black recovers the piece with 25 ... Rd1. Still a premature resignation by my standards.> True but Stockfish 8 is giving a poor outcome for White.
Still a human would normally play on a bit longer
in case the opponent made a mistake.
25. Bxc1
(♗e3xc1 ♖d8-d1 ♔f1-e2 ♖d1xc1 ♗b7-e4 ♖c1-c3 ♘e1-c2 g7-g5 ♗e4-d3 ♗f6-e5
h2-h3 ♔g8-g7 ♔e2-d2 h7-h5 ♔d2-e2 ♗e5-f4 a3-a4 ♗f4-d6 a4-a5 ♖c3-b3 a5xb6
a7xb6 b4-b5 ♗d6-c5 f2-f3 ♖b3-b2 ♔e2-d1 ♖b2-b1+ ♔d1-e2 ♖b1-b3 ♘c2-e1 ♔g7-f6
♔e2-d2 ♗c5-f2 ♘e1-c2 ♖b3-b1 ♔d2-e2 ♗f2-c5 ♘c2-e1 ♖b1-b2+ ♔e2-d1 ♖b2-f2
♗d3-c4 h5-h4 ♗c4-e2 ♗c5-d6 ♗e2-c4 ♗d6-b4 ♘e1-c2 ♗b4-c5 ♘c2-e1 ♗c5-e3
♗c4-e2) -3.83/39 121
score for White -3.83 depth 39 |
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Jan-25-18
 | | Stonehenge: Fengshui's play wasn't very harmonious. |
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| Jan-25-18 | | Cheapo by the Dozen: I spent some time looking at the ... Nxf3+ and ... Ne2+ possibilities, but very little at ... Qxb7. I.e., I whiffed on the puzzle. |
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| Jan-25-18 | | thegoodanarchist: Pun Title:
Where the Sun Doesn't Shine |
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| Jan-25-18 | | njchess: The sequence of 20. ... ♘xd4 21. ♕xb7 is pretty obvious. The key is to lure White's bishop away from guarding e2 so Black can play ♘e2+ without fear of capture, thereby gaining an extra move. So, 21. ... ♕xb7 22. ♗xb7 ♖xc1 23. ♖xc1 ♘e2+ 24. ♔f1 ♘xc1 25. ♗xc1 -+ The knight will fall after 25. ... ♖d1 followed by ♗c3. Game over. |
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| Jan-25-18 | | saturn2: All in all a very nice puzzle with some ways to get wrong for both sides.
For example
20 ..Nd4 21 QxB Nxf3??
Or
20.. Nd4 21 QxB Ne2+ 22 BxNe2??
Or
20..Nd4 21 QxB Ne2+ 22 Kf1 RxRc1?? 23 KxNe2 |
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| Jan-25-18 | | morfishine: "Wenjun Engine" |
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Jan-25-18
 | | ChessHigherCat: "Sun down" |
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Jan-25-18
 | | Breunor: N xd4 jumped out at me immediately; unfortunately I couldn't find the correct continuation. |
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| Jan-25-18 | | MostlyWatch: I'm the guy who often does not see why they resigned. In fact, I sometimes wonder if that's what DID happen... or if White just got sick and went to the hospital and defaulted. I've often been struck by the paucity of standard chess notation. We need something better than 0-1 to tell us what happened. What would be wrong with "White resigns"? It's not like we are in a POW camp and have to write small on one little dab of paper. This is the computer age, and memory is very cheap! Think loquacious! Some of this is due to chess masters setting a bar: "If you can't see why he resigned you don't belong here." So beginners like me are repelled. Result: chess remains an arcane sport with little funding. Not many high schools or colleges have a chess team with uniforms, lockers, and cheerleaders! but football does??? /rant |
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Jan-25-18
| | ChessHigherCat: <MostlyWatch: It's not like we are in a POW camp and have to write small on one little dab of paper. This is the computer age, and memory is very cheap! Think loquacious!> I agree. <Zanzibar> mentioned a variety of improvements to notation (symbols for resignation vs. flagging, etc.) Unfortunately nobody here seems to adopt those systems. I work with a lot of German lawyers and bankers who are impossible to understand because they use all kinds of needless abbreviations and omit half the essential information. If you complain about it, they quote the world's stupidest maxim: "Less is more!". I say, "Yeah, less is more confusing! Do you have to pay a dollar per word at Western Union rates or what?" |
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Jan-25-18
| | ChessHigherCat: Of course a modicum of concision is always welcome :-) |
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| Jan-25-18 | | Strelets: Overthinking is the bane of chess. Sometimes a move just "feels" right. You don't have to be Tal or Anand to get that feeling; all it takes is practice and the ability to recall positions and tactics from other games you've seen, played, or analyzed. Here, 20...Nxd4!, thanks to the fianchettoed x-ray bishop, just "felt" right. |
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Jan-25-18
| | ChessHigherCat: <Streletz> I saw the first move quickly, too, but partly because it was a puzzle, which implies a certain type of move. Also, what about all the "spoilers" where 99% of players will immediately see a move that "jumps right out at them" but doesn't work for some diabolical reason. |
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| Jan-25-18 | | morfishine: <cocker> After 24...Nxc1 25.Bxc1 Rd1
26.Be3 Bc3 Black regains the piece and is an exchange plus a pawn up:
click for larger view***** |
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| Jan-25-18 | | Granny O Doul: Another thing, MostlyWatch, is that "0-1" on this site often means that Black won forty moves later, but this position is as far as we could read the score sheets. |
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| Jun-07-18 | | Returning Native: <I'm the guy who often does not see why they resigned. In fact, I sometimes wonder if that's what DID happen... or if White just got sick and went to the hospital and defaulted. I've often been struck by the paucity of standard chess notation. We need something better than 0-1 to tell us what happened. What would be wrong with "White resigns"? It's not like we are in a POW camp and have to write small on one little dab of paper. This is the computer age, and memory is very cheap! Think loquacious!
Some of this is due to chess masters setting a bar: "If you can't see why he resigned you don't belong here." So beginners like me are repelled. Result: chess remains an arcane sport with little funding. Not many high schools or colleges have a chess team with uniforms, lockers, and cheerleaders! but football does??? /rant> Good point |
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| Jun-07-18 | | Returning Native: Sorry, <Mostly Watch> |
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