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Martinez Martinez vs Juan Jose Converset
ARG-ch U18 (1994), Buenos Aires, rd 7
King's Indian Defense: Smyslov Variation (E61)  ·  1-0



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Kibitzer's Corner
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 2 OF 2 ·  Later Kibitzing>
Nov-13-14  Cheapo by the Dozen: A fairly hard puzzle for a Wednesday if you want to demand calculation to the finish, as per the line I called out as unclear and also <Dr. J>'s move that I missed. (Too often in these puzzles I regard a move that obviously loses as not being available at all.)

But in terms of calculating that the sacrifice should obviously be attempted, it seems to be somewhat easier. :)

Nov-13-14  M.Hassan: Medium"
White to play 22.?
White has a Knight for a Bishop which is considered to be equal

White Queen is on light square, White has a LSB, hence getting the f7 pawn is justified:

22.Nxf7 Kxf7
<if...Ke8 Bh5#>

24.Rd6+ Bxd6
25.Rxd6+ Re6
26.Qxh6+ Kf7
27.Bh5+ Ke7
28.Qxe6+ Kf8

If the Night sac is declined:
22.Nxf7 Re7
23.Nxe5 White wins material and if continued:

24.Bh5 Bxh5
25.Rd7+ Be7
26.Rxe7 Kf6
27.Nd7+ and it is a Royal fork and it should be the time to resign and is my time to check

Game line is quite different in that Black aggressively attacks White Queen

Nov-13-14  plumbst: Medium. White is up a pawn.

White has a winning attack after 22.Nxf7! Kxf7 23.Qh7+

23...Bg7 (23...Kf6 34.Rd6+)
24.Bh5+ Kf8 (other moves get mated)

Black has no good defence to the threat of Rf6+: 25...Re7 26.R1d5; 25...Be4 26.Bg6 Bxg6 27.Qxg6

Nov-13-14  nalinw: <Cheapo> It is Thursday :-)
Premium Chessgames Member
  agb2002: White has a bishop, a knight and a pawn for the bishop pair.

The light squares around the black king look very weak and might be used by the white queen and bishop to attack. Therefore, 22.Nxf7:

A) 22... Kxf7 23.Bh5+ (23.Qh7+ Bg7 (else 24.Bh5 looks winning) 24.Bh5+ Kf8 25.Rd7 (25.Qg6 Qc7) 25... Bxd7 26.Rxd7 Re7 27.Rxe7 Kxe7 28.Qxg7+ Kd6 29.Qf6+ Kc7 30.Qe7+ Kb8 and White cannot win the remaining rook)

A.1) 23... Ke(f)6 24.Qg6+ Ke7 25.Qf7#.

A.2) 23... Ke7 24.Qh7+ and mate in two.

A.3) 23... Kg7 24.Qg6+ Kh8 25.Rd7 (25.Qf6+ Bg7 26.Rd8+ Re8 and Black seems to hold)

A.3.a) 25... Bxd7 26.Qxb6 + - [Q+2P vs R+N].

A.3.b) 25... Be7 26.Qxh6+ Kg8 27.Bg6 looks catastrophic for Black.

A.3.c) 25... Re7 26.Rxe7 Bxe7 27.Qxh6+ Kg8 28.Bg6 is similar to A.3.b.

A.4) 23... Kg8 24.Qg6+ Bg7 (24... Kh8 transposes to A.3) 25.Rd7 Bxd7 26.Qxb6 as in A.3.a.

B) 22... Re6 23.Nd8 Rf6 24.Nxc6 Qxc6 25.Rd7 and White has two extra pawns and keeps the attack.

C) 22... Re7 23.Qg6+ Bg7 24.Nxh6+ Kf8 (24... Kh8 25.Nf7+ Kg8 26.Nxg5 with four extra pawns) 25.Qh7 Bxh6 26.Qh8+ Kf7 27.Bh5+ Ke6 28.Rd6+ Kf5 29.Qf6+ Ke4 30.Bf3(g6)#.

D) 22... Re8 23.Qg6+ looks similar to C.

Nov-13-14  diagonalley: is martinez martinez related to vincent twice vincent twice i wonder...
Nov-13-14  patzer2: Got 22. Nxf7! for my Thursday solution, but made it harder than necessary by visualizing only the line 22...Kxf7 23. Rd7+ (stronger is 23. Qh7+ or 23. Bh6+ ) 23...Bxd7+ 24. Qh7+ .

Did not consider 22. Nxf7! Be4, but the reply 23. Qc3 seems obvious enough.

Nov-13-14  morfishine: Sac on<f7>

22.Nxf7 Kxf7 23.Qh7+ (Black defends after 23...Bh5+? Kg7 24.Rd7+ Bxd7 25.Rxd7+ Re7 26.Qc3+ Qf6)...Kf6 24.Rd6+ Bxd6 25.Rxd6+

click for larger view

White wins after 25...Re6 26.Qxh6+ Ke7 27.Qxe6+

Is it better for Black to decline the sac?

22.Nxf7 <22...Re6> 23.Qf5 Re7 24.Ne5 Be8 25.Rd6 Qc7 26.Nd7 Bxd7 27.Rxd7 Rxd7 28.Rxd7

click for larger view

Oh well, fairly typical for me: Even when I attempt to find all reasonable alternatives, I end up overlooking one, here for some reason, I didn't consider 22...Be4


Nov-13-14  starry2013: I tried Nf7, Qh7 and ran the King all over but couldn't finish. The bishops are the main problem IF it's meant to be checkmate.
Nov-13-14  goodevans: Seeing the win after <22.Nxf7 Kxf7> was pretty easy, but there are several reasonable ways to decline the sac that also need to be considered. I got there eventually but it took longer than the average Thursday.
Nov-13-14  gofer: Pf7 is holding black's defensive position together - between Kg8 and Pf7 they control g6 and h7; the two entry squares for Qc2. So white gives up Nd6 to gain entry!

<22 Nxf7 ...>

White threatens Nxe5 and Qg6+ Bg7 Nxh6+ Kh8 Nf7+ Kg8 Nxg5 stripping away black's defensive pawns, but taking the knight is an immediate loss as black does not control the 7th rank...

22 ... Kxf7?
23 Qh7+ ...

23 ... Ke8
24 Bh5#

23 ... Ke6
24 Bg4+ mating

23 ... Kf6
24 Rd6+ ...

24 ... Bxd6
25 Rxd6+ Re6
26 Qxh6+ mating

24 ... Re6
25 Rxe6+ Kxe6
26 Bg4+ Kf6
27 Bf5! mating

23 ... Bg7
24 Rd7+ Bxd7
25 Rxd7+ Ke8/Ke6
26 Qxg7 Qe6
27 Bh5+ mating

So what else can black do? well he must try to stop Qg6+.

22 ... Re6
23 Nd8 Rf6
24 Nxc6 Qxc6
25 Rd7

click for larger view

What else is there?


OMG, how could I miss Be4? How did we all miss it?!?!

<Nil point tout le monde>

Premium Chessgames Member
  Oxspawn: Just like to point out that if you start with
22. Nf5.....
things do not go so well for white.
On the plus side it kept me occupied me for my coffee break...
Premium Chessgames Member
  Penguincw: I got the first move (22.Nxf7), which is usually the only thing I get on Thursday puzzles (and beyond).
Nov-13-14  PJs Studio: I'm sure it was played OTB over the board with a "let's see what happens after this!"

If it gives white a lasting attack it may be fine EVEN if it isn't proven 100% accurate. Tal lived in a world like that, and we all know how well it suited him. ;)

Premium Chessgames Member
  kevin86: I saw the key move, but not much after that.
Premium Chessgames Member
  Jimfromprovidence: For the record if 22 Nxf7 Re6, white also has Ne5!

click for larger view

The rook can't abandon its defense against Qf6+.

Nov-13-14  starry2013: I still can't see the checkmate in this line

22 ... Kxf7?
23 Qh7+ ...
23 ... Kf6
24 Rd6+ ...
24 ... Re6
25 Rxe6+ Kxe6
26 Bg4+ Kf6

Nov-13-14  TheBish: Martinez Martinez vs J Converset, 1994

White to play (22.?) "Medium"

White is up a pawn, but I suppose the solution is not simply to trade down and win the endgame! With White's superior development combined with Black's weakened king position (and the loose rook on e5 might be a factor), White definitely has an attack about to commence. But a move like 22. Bh5 seems a little too slow, allowing Black his choice of defensive moves. A better choice seems to be a piece sac to further expose the king to the wrath of the remaining White pieces.

22. Nxf7! Kxf7

Not what? We have three choices of bringing a White piece into play with tempo (check), but which one? 23. Rd7+ Bxd7 24. Rxd7+ Re7 leaves us a little lacking. Both 23. Bh5+ and 23. Qh7+ seem good, until we look at 23. Qh7+ Bg7 24. Rd7+ (24. Bh5+ Kf8 seems to go nowhere) 24...Bxd7 25. Rxd7+ Re7 26. Rxe7+ Kxe7 27. Qxg7+ Kd6! (better than 27...Kd8 28. Qf8+ or 27...Ke6? 28. Bg4+) and White's attack runs out of steam. So bringing the bishop into play now seems the right choice.

23. Bh5+! and now:

(a) 23...Kg7 24. Qg6+ Kh8 25. Rd7 Re7 (the Bc6 is pinned) 26. Rxe7 Bxe7 27. Rd7 and Black will have to give up the queen (27...Bxd7 28. Qxb6) to stop mate.

(b) 23...Kg8 24. Qg6+ Bg7 (24...Kh8 transposes to variation a) 25. Rd7 and once again 25...Bxd7 27. Qxb6 is forced to stop mate.

(c) 23...Kf6 24. Qg6+ Ke7 25. Qf7# is not exactly a fighting way to finish the game!

(d) 23...Ke6 24. Qg6+ Ke7 25. Qf7# is the same as variation c.

(e) 23...Ke7 24. Qh7+ Bg7 (other moves allow 25. Qf7#) 25. Qxg7+ Ke6 26. Qf7#.

Black's best chance may be to decline the knight offer with 22...Re6, but then he is two pawns down and White can choose between simplification with 23. Nd8 or continuing the attack with moves like 23. Bh5 followed by Rd8.


Well, I missed Black's defensive move 22...Be4, but that's where the loose rook on e5 comes into play: 23. Qc3 either wins the exchange or continues a devastating attack.

Nov-13-14  starry2013: <Cheapo by the Dozen - Kf6 runs afoul of the Qh8 skewer attack on the king and rook. I haven't calculated through to a forced win, but Black's only hope not to have a serious material deficit is:>

The skewer doesn't win the rook. Still needs to be proven.

Nov-13-14  Dr. J: <patzer2: Got 22. Nxf7! Kxf7 23. Rd7+(?)... (stronger is 23. Qh7+ or 23. Bh6+ )>

I presume you meant 23. Bh5+ (not 25. Bh6+), which <agb2002> showed is winning: < 23... Kg8 24.Qg6+ Kh8 25.Rd7 Re7 (25... Bxd7 26.Qxb6, or 25... Be7 26.Qxh6+ Kg8 27.Bg6) 26.Rxe7 Bxe7 27.Qxh6+ Kg8 28.Bg6!>, but, to repeat myself, I couldn't force the win after 23 Qh7+ Bg7 24 Rd7+ Bxd7 25 Rd7+ Re7 26 Rxe7+ Kxe7 27 Qxg7+ Kd6 e.g. 27 Qxh6+ Kc7 28 Qg7+ Kb8 29 b3 or 29 g3 which leaves White with an excellent but not yet decisive position. What was your continuation?

Nov-13-14  Cheapo by the Dozen: <starry2013>,

As per my post, Black either has to give up the rook or else give up the exchange and also bring his king to g4.

Nov-13-14  Rhialto: 22.Nxf7 Kxf7 23.Qh7+ Bg7 24.Bh5+ Kf8 25.Qg6 seems like the simplest to me, pinning the light-squared bishop while threatening mate; 25...Re7 26.Rd7 Rxe7 27.Rxe7 and 25...Kg8 26.Rd7 Bxd7 27.Qxb6 both look pretty done.
Nov-13-14  patzer2: <Dr. J> Thanks! I did mean 22. Nxf7! Kxf7 23. Rd7+ (stronger is 23. Qh7+ or 23. Bh5+ )...

After <22. Nxf7! Kxf7 23. Qh7+ Bg7 24. Rd7+ Bxd7 25. Rxd7+ Re7> (diagram below)

click for larger view

Fritz indicates White wins with 26. Bh5+! Kf8 27. Rxe7! Kxe7 28. Qxg7+ Kd6 29. e4!! (diagram below)

click for larger view

Here, the threat 30. e5+ is clearly decisive.

Nov-14-14  starry2013: <Cheapo by the Dozen:
As per my post, Black either has to give up the rook or else give up the exchange and also bring his king to g4.>

My computer opponent plays Kf5.

Nov-14-14  starry2013: Yes I saw that line myself, black still with bishops and only the equivalent of a pawn down I think.
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