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Pontus Carlsson vs Ioannis Papaioannou
European Team Championship (2007), Heraklion GRE, rd 3, Oct-30
Scandinavian Defense: Main Lines. Mieses Variation (B01)  ·  1-0



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Kibitzer's Corner
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 2 OF 2 ·  Later Kibitzing>
Mar-25-17  sfm: Great resistance to the very end. Cute little trick with 38.-,Qd7. People give up much too early. I have probably won 15% of my "hopeless positions" over time. And 85% of my "decisive advantages". It adds up to that it is 100% certain that fighting pays.
Mar-25-17  The Kings Domain: Missed this one, I thought 27) Rh1 was the winner. Deep and impressive puzzle and a striking victory.
Mar-25-17  Walter Glattke: To the question of 39.Kc1 I found 39.-Qa4?? 40.Bxe5! but also 39.-Nd3+ 40.cxd3 Qc8+, may win for White, but 39.Bd6 should be better, threatens Qc8#
Mar-25-17  Walter Glattke: I had a mistake with the final 1-0 Position,what happened after 42.Rg1!? WHY? 1-0. 42.-Rh8 43.Qd3 f5, where is the mate here?
Mar-25-17  RandomVisitor: Longer computer look... 27.a3 is a surprise

click for larger view


<+1.00/38 27.Bxe6 fxe6 28.Qxe6 Ra5 29.Bc3 Ra6> 30.Qxd7 Qxd7 31.Rxd7 Bf4 32.a3 Be5 33.Bd2 Rd6 34.Rxd6 Bxd6 35.c4 Kc7 36.Kc2 Kc6 37.Kd3 f5 38.b4 b5 39.Kc3 a6 40.Kb3 Be5 41.Bc3 Bc7 42.Bd4 Bf4 43.a4 bxa4+ 44.Ka3 Bd6 45.Kxa4 Bc7 46.f3 Kd6 47.Bc3 Ke6 48.Kb3 Kd6 49.Bf6 Kc6 50.Bd4

+0.90/38 27.a3 a6 28.Rh1 Bf8 29.Rh7 Bc5 30.Bxe6 Rg5 31.Bxc5 Nxc5 32.Bxf7 Re5 33.Qc4 Re4 34.Qd5 Re2 35.f3 Re7 36.Rh8+ Ka7 37.Bg6 Rd7 38.Qc4 Rg7 39.Rh7 Rxh7 40.Bxh7 Qe5 41.Qb4 f5 42.Bg8 Qd6 43.Qc4 Nd7 44.Qd5 Qxd5 45.Bxd5 b5 46.Ka2 Nf6 47.Be6 f4 48.Kb3 Kb6 49.Kb4 a5+ 50.Kc3 Kc5 51.Kd3

+0.56/38 27.c3 Bf4 28.Rh1 Qd8 29.Qe4 a6 30.a3 Bc7 31.Rh7 Nc5 32.Bxc5 Rxc5 33.Rxf7 Re5 34.Qh7 Re2 35.Rd7 Qc8 36.Rg7 Rd2 37.f3 Bd8 38.Qe4 Rd6 39.Rg8 Qd7 40.f4 Ka7 41.Ka2 Rb6 42.Rf8 Be7 43.Rf7 f5 44.Qe5 Qd8 45.Qd4 Qxd4 46.cxd4 Bh4 47.d5 exd5 48.Bxd5 Bf2 49.Bf3 Be3 50.Rxf5 Rh6

Mar-25-17  SpamIAm: <Walter Glattke>, methinks that black simply had had enough. There's no mate but after 42.Rg1 Rh8 White simply plays 43.Bc5 followed by 44.Qa7+, simplfying to an easily won rook endgame 3 pawns up. That was the real purpose of 42.Rg1- unpinning the bishop.
Mar-25-17  Carlos0012358: Black is one pawn up and has a N for a B. However, black's K is trapped behind a wall of pawns and pieces.

How to get around the black blockade and attack the K?

Two approaches
27.Bxe6 creating an opening for the white Q
or 27.Rh1 attacking the black B and circumventing black's blockade

I would say 27.Bxe6 is the better approach

Premium Chessgames Member
  PawnSac: < RandomVisitor: Longer computer look... 27.a3 is a surprise >

the idea is not a surprise, as is seen from the game continuation a good portion of black's defense/counter is based on the relative weakness of white's back rank.

what surprises me is that in the overall picture the computer gives the better eval to the seemingly passive move!

Oh the irony of it all ... lol

Mar-25-17  morfishine: White is relentless against his squirming foe

Seems like a number of lines offer sustained initiative


Premium Chessgames Member
  agb2002: White has the bishop pair for a bishop, a knight and a pawn.

The first idea that comes to mind is 27.Bxe6, trying to exploit the position of the black rook and Black's weak back rank:

A) 27... fxe6 28.Qxe6

A.1) 28... Ra5 29.Bc3 (a nice line is 29.Bb6 Qxb6 30.Qe8+ Kc7 31.Qxd7+ Kb8 32.Qe8+ Kc7 33.Qd8+ Kc6 34.Qd7+ Kc5 35.Qd5+ Kb4 36.c3+ Ka4 37.Qc4+ Qb4 38.Qxb4# but Black has 29... axb6)

A.1.a) 30... Ra6 31.Qxd7 wins a pawn at least.

A.1.b) 30... Rh5 31.Qe8+ Qc7 32.Qxh5 + - [R+P vs n].

A.1.c) 30... Rc5 31.Rxd7 with an extra pawn and the threats Rxc7 and Qe8+ looks winning (31... Qc8 32.Qd6+ followed by 33.Rd8 wins).

A.2) 28... Rb(g,h)5 29.Qe8+ Qc8 30.Bxa7+ Kxa7 31.Qxc8 + - [Q+P vs b+n].

A.3) 28... Qf4 29.Qxd7 wins a pawn at least.

B) 27... Rf4 28.Bxd7 wins a piece (28... Qxd7 29.Bxa7+ and 30.Rxd7).

Premium Chessgames Member
  agb2002: I probably overlooked Kc7 due to the residual image with the black queen on c7.
Mar-25-17  newzild: A very easy Saturday. I saw everything up to 38. Bb8.
Premium Chessgames Member
  PawnSac: PawnSac: < newzild: A very easy Saturday. I saw everything up to 38. Bb8. >

likewise, but instead of Bb8;

< 38. ? white to move >

click for larger view

In this position there is nothing wrong with Qxf6 Nc6 Be3

Black's goose is cooked. There's no need to get fancy. So i was wondering why he play it? It's easy to see the trap Qxb8? Qa6+ Qa7 Rd8# So after Bb8 Nc6 Bf4 white can guard the back rank with a Bc1 so that frees the Rook, but still Qxf6 does win a pawn. maybe black was low on the clock before time control and white complicated so black would implode?? (we don't have the time stamps)

In any event, interesting game.

Premium Chessgames Member
  PawnSac: <28. ..Rf3?!>

<Tiggler: I saw everything up to 30.Ba7+, though I missed 28...Ra5, which would have saved black from the worst.>

black clearly hoped to win the F pawn in the ensuing play after Bxa7+, suggesting he underestimated the danger.

<35. ..Rh3 >

When looking for alternate moves I very quickly saw 35 ..Qd7 does not work. 36. Qxf3 Nxf3 37. Rxd7+ Kxd7 38. Bxb6 leaves black with a hopelessly lost ending. But after a second look I realized
36. Bxb6+ Kxb6 37. Qxf3 Nxf3 38. Rxd7 Kc6 39. Rf7 Ne5 40. Rxf6+ is even better, proving to myself "When you find a good move, sit on your hands and look for a better one". Had I been playing blitz i probably would have played Qxf3 immediately, but that's a downfall of blitz. When we see a clear win we rarely let the clock tick looking for more.

Premium Chessgames Member
  PawnSac: PawnSac: < 31.Qh5 !? >

click for larger view

While trying to anticipate all white's moves i also chose Qh5 in this position. Afterward I loaded the game into Stockfish 7 x64 and had some interesting surprises. Here was one. Instead of Qh5, it found the very nice move Qe6! ( 41/67 50:49 2,641,060k 866k +6.17 Qe8-e6 )

click for larger view

The threat is 32. Bb6+ Kb8 (not ..Nxb6?? Qd6#) 33. Qd6+ Ka8 34. Qxd7 (and the back rank is defenseless) Qxd7 (what else?!) 35. Rxd7 Bf4 36. Rd8+ Bb8 37. Bc7 In this line white can also play 34.Rd5 Bd2 35.Qxd7 as it ends up the same.

So after 31. Qe6! black must play ..Bf8 to prevent the mate, then comes 32. Qg4 ...

click for larger view

and the rook is trapped, because if 32 ..Ne5? 33. Bb6+ and black must give up the Q with ..Kxb6 or else 33...Kb8 34.Qxc8+ Kxc8 35.Rd8# !

That Ba7 is a real monster and must be traded off! Thus...

31.Qe6 Bf8 32.Qg4 Bc5 33. Bxc5 Nxc5 34. Qxf3 Qe6 35. Qc3 etc.

Mar-25-17  RandomVisitor: After 27.Bxe6 fxe6 28.Qxe6 <Ra5> 29.Bc3 Ra6 30.Qxd7 Qxd7 31.Rxd7

click for larger view

white is up a pawn but Komodo cannot find a direct win due to a fortress-like position that black is able to form:


+1.22/51 31...Bf4 32.a3 Be5 33.Bd2 Rd6 34.Rxd6 Bxd6 35.c4 Kc7 36.Kc2 Kc6 37.a4 a6 38.b4 b5 39.cxb5+ axb5 40.a5 f5 41.Kd3 Be7 42.Kc3 Bf6+ 43.Kb3 Kb7 44.Be3 Be5 45.Kc2 Bd6 46.Bc5 <Bf4> 47.Kb2 Bh2 48.Kc3 Be5+ 49.Kd3 Bf6 50.Kd2 Bg7 51.Ke2 Bb2 52.f3 Be5 53.Kd3 Ka6 54.Be7 Kb7 55.Bf8 Bf6 56.Bc5 Ka6 57.Ke3 Be5 58.Be7 Kb7 59.Bf8

for example, in the line above black can achieve this position after 46...Bf4:

click for larger view

Premium Chessgames Member
  PawnSac: < RandomVisitor: After 27.Bxe6 fxe6 28.Qxe6 <Ra5> 29.Bc3 Ra6 30.Qxd7 Qxd7 31.Rxd7 white is up a pawn but Komodo cannot find a direct win >

I found the same thing with Stockfish.
The resulting position looks identical.

Premium Chessgames Member
  PawnSac: < 35.Qd5 >

click for larger view

Here was another interesting spot.. While anticipating moves, I chose Qd5, as did white in the game, but Stockfish gives the stronger Qd4! The advantage of Qd4 over Qd5 is that the attack on b6 does not allow black time for Rh3, and therefore deprives black counterplay on white's back rank.

Stockfish 7 x64:
45/75 1:13:40 4,445,874k 1,006k +47.85
Qe4-d4 Qc8-e6 Qd4-d8+ Kc7-b7 Qd8-b8+ Kb7-a6 Ba7xb6 Ne5-c6 Qb8-c7 Qe6-e2 Rd1-g1 Rf3-c3 b2xc3 Qe2-b5+ Kb1-a1 Qb5xb6 Qc7-c8+ Qb6-b7 Qc8-e6 Qb7-c7 Rg1-b1 Ka6-a7 Qe6-c4 Ka7-a8 Qc4-c5 Qc7-d7 Rb1-b6 Nc6-a7 Qc5-b4 Na7-c8 Rb6-b8+ Ka8-a7 Rb8-b5 Qd7xb5 Qb4xb5 Ka7-a8 c3-c4 Nc8-a7 Qb5-e8+ Ka8-b7 Qe8-e7+ Kb7-b8 Qe7xf6 Kb8-c8 Qf6-d6 Kc8-b7 Qd6-d7+ Kb7-a8 Qd7-d5+ Ka8-b8 Qd5-e5+ Kb8-b7 Qe5-e7+ Kb7-b6 Qe7-f6+ Kb6-b7 Qf6-f7+ Kb7-b6

in the line above, if 38...Qxb6? 39.Rd6 Nc6 (Qxd6 and Qc6 also fail miserably) 40.Qc8+ Kb5 41.Rd5+ Kc4? (..Qc5) Stockfish gives 42.Qe6! with mate in 16

click for larger view

46/33 00:25 32,178k 1,258k -M16 Qb6-c5 Qe6-e4+ Kc4-b5 Qe4xf3 Kb5-b6 Rd5xc5 Kb6xc5 Qf3xf6 Kc5-d5 c2-c4+ Kd5-c5 Qf6-f8+ Kc5xc4 Qf8-d6 Nc6-d4 b2-b3+ Kc4-d3 Qd6-e5 Kd3-d2 Qe5xd4+ Kd2-e2 Kb1-c2 Ke2-f1 Qd4-g4 Kf1-e1 Kc2-d3 Ke1xf2 a2-a4 Kf2-f1 Kd3-e3 Kf1-e1 Qg4-e2+

if 42...Rf4?? Rh5+ Kd4 Qd5#

Premium Chessgames Member
  PawnSac: It's interesting that both Stockfish improvements i posted (31.Qe6 and 35.Qd4) really reveal and exploit the error of black's 28. ..Rf3
Mar-26-17  saturn2: 28 ..Rf3 made the win possible for white.
28 ..Ra5 is also bad because of the double attack 29 Bc3.

What about 28..Rb5?

Premium Chessgames Member
  PawnSac: < saturn2: 28 ..Rf3 made the win possible for white. >

yes, due to the bad location of the rook plus positional compensation from white's piece sac.

< 28 ..Ra5 is also bad because of the double attack 29 Bc3. >

a move is not 'bad' if the moved piece can be attacked again. The R is relocated to a6 where it attacks the white Q

< What about 28..Rb5? >

The point of ..Ra5 was to add guard to the a7 pawn which is attacked by white's B. More to the point, the rook guards the SQUARE so that the B can not occupy it. The white B on a7 forces the K to c7 where it is exposed to further attack. 25...Rb5 is insufficient because it doesn't address this problem.

As far as the double attack is concerned, the line takes into account the return of the sacrificed material in order to defang white's attack. Here's the point...

After 28. Qxe6 Ra5 29. Bc3 Ra6 30. Qxd7 Qxd7 31. Rxd7 Kc8

click for larger view

black has pretty much leveled the play. As we discussed earlier, tho white has an extra pawn, even the progs (Komodo & Stockfish) were unable to find a convincing win. The nature of the position is very drawish.

The bottom line is that 28...Ra5 is the best move for black

Mar-27-17  newzild: <RandomVisitor> In your "fortress" position, White's king invades on the light squares via the h-file and attacks Black's g-pawn.

This is the kind of win a human can see more easily than a computer.

Mar-27-17  saturn2: <PawnSac> I was thinking after 28..Rb5 black can keep the knight on d7. For example 29 Qe8+ Qc8 30 Bxa7+ Kc7
Mar-29-17  Moszkowski012273: 31.Qe6... is quite a bit stronger, but who would have the nerve to play it?
Mar-29-17  Moszkowski012273: Also 38...Qd7 39.Kc1... and Black is totally lost.
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