| Jun-25-03 | | Bears092: Wow... this one doesn't look too easy, and I got it... |
|
| Jun-25-03 | | patzer2: After 34...Rc5! 35. Rxc5 Rh1, black only has to be careful in maneuvering his king away from the white spite checks. After 38...Kd8, the only way white can avoid an immediate mate is 39. Rd5 KxNc8 40. RxBd3 exRd3, leaving black a rook up in an easily won position. |
|
| Jun-25-03 | | sarayu: I don't get 35. Rxc5... Clearly that permits the inevitable checkmate. Wouldn't Akobian have protected his back rank at all costs, even though losing his c7 pawn? Hopeless, though... |
|
| Jun-25-03 | | Elrathia Kingi: This isn't a king's pawn game. Looks more like a Queen's Gambit Declined Slav (D10). |
|
Jun-25-03
 | | chessgames.com: Thanks Elrathia, it's fixed now (D14) |
|
| Jun-25-03 | | patzer2: <Sarayu> While 35. Rxc5 loses, so do all the alternatives. If 35.f7-f8(Q), then 35....R(h8)xf8 is winning for black. If 35.Rd1, then simply 35....Rxf7 is a won game. If 35. a5, then 35...Rxc1 wins. The only other try for complications was 35. Nf5+ Kf6 36. Rxc5 Rh1 37. Rc6+ Kg5 when white is in essentially the same losing predicament as in the game continuation (due to the threatened 38. Rf1 mate). I suspect white just wanted to end this game quickly, and not suffer through the longer losing alternatives, when he chose 35. Rxc5. |
|
| Aug-05-04 | | athyn: Underpromotions fascinate me. |
|
| Aug-05-04 | | AdrianP: Me too, there are I think there are three sorts of underpromotions:- (1) Underpromotions which weren't necessary, but which a player plays for "aesthetic" reasons (more like showing off...!).
(2) Underpromotions to a Knight which were necessary (in that a Knight can reach or check some square which a Q could not) - rare but not extremely rare.
(3) Underpromotions to a R or B where this is necessary i.e. promotion to a Q would not do (usually (invariably?) because of stalemate themes). These are extremely rare and are usually the realm of problems but I think there are a few examples in practical play... anyone? |
|
| Aug-05-04 | | athyn: Yes, that is a good anlysis AdrainP. |
|
| Aug-05-04 | | acirce: There are a few of the strict "3" kind but not many at all, there are some on the border but at least <Von Guretzky Cornitz - Neumann, Berlin 1863> and a few others on http://www.xs4all.nl/~timkr/chess2/... must count. In many of the other cases there were other ways to win but for example tricky in practical play or that they just involved not promoting the pawn in that exact moment but later. |
|
Aug-05-04
 | | Sneaky: <(1) Underpromotions which weren't necessary, but which a plater plays for "aesthetic" reasons (more like showing off...!)> That's what I classify as "Underpromoting just to be a wiseguy."
See V Malakhov vs E Shaposhnikov, 2001 |
|
| Aug-05-04 | | AdrianP: <acirce> Probably the most famous endgame underpromotion is the Saveedra Position The position is:
White: K on b6 and pawn on c6
Black: R on d5 and K on a1
White to play and win.
1 c7 Rd6+
2 Kb5 Rd5+
3 Kb4 Rd4+
4 Kb3 Rd3+
5 Kc2! Rd4!
6 c8R!! (6 c8Q? Rc4+ 7 Qxc4 is drawn by stalemate) Ra4
7 Kb3  |
|
| Aug-05-04 | | acirce: Yes, but has it occurred in a recorded, practical game? |
|
Aug-05-04
 | | cu8sfan: <Sneaky> A guy at a school tournament once underpromoted to a ♗ and all he had left was a ♘. He said he wanted to check if he still knew how to checkmate with a ♗ and ♘. He did, btw. |
|
| Aug-05-04 | | AdrianP: I dunno but I doubt it - I'll have a look in the Mega Database at home. |
|
Aug-07-04
| | Sneaky: <cu8sfan> That's beyond promoting to be a wiseguy--that's being a knucklehead! An old issue of Chess Life showed this weird position where White was missing all of his pawns, and Black had only a king on e8. The story was that somebody in the D-section was utterly thrashing a little child at a tournament, up a queen, a rook, a bishop, and plenty of pawns. The child didn't resign (kids are often like that) so this meanie with the White pieces began to promote all of his extra pawns into the pieces that he was missing and finally arranged his army back to its starting location. Normally I would tell that jerk to "get a life"--but after all, he did get published in a magazine, so I guess his little ploy for attention worked. |
|
| Aug-07-04 | | pawntificator: heh heh....hey sneaky! How about another rematch!! I'm yet to defeat you and its frustrating. Challenge me if you dare! Bwa ha ha ha!!! ;) |
|
| Aug-19-04 | | athyn: I was playing chess not long ago against a computer and the computer underpromoted to a Rook. It didn't matter because it was checkmate with either a Rook or Queen; so it may have been an arbitrary choice rather than just showing off, but since I don't know the exact way the program was written I will never know. |
|
| Sep-28-04 | | pawntificator: I imagine it was supposed to be an ego crushing feature of your chess program. |
|
Kibitzing
sac: 34...Rc5