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Later Kibitzing> |
| Nov-16-08 | | peristilo: I thought 17...gxf6 followed by Kh8 and Rg8 could be a good defense for black. But white replies with the lethal Rh3, wich is good enough to win. |
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| Nov-16-08 | | johnlspouge: Toga gives the following best play variation after
18…Kxg7 19.Qf6+ <Kg8> 20.Rh3 (threatening 21.Rf1 22.Qxf7+ 23.Qf6+ 24.Rg3#)
20…Qd8 21.Rg3+ Kf8 22.Qh6+ Ke7 23.Rg7 Qf8
Black is toast because 24.Nxd5 will open the d-file. |
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| Nov-16-08 | | johnlspouge: < <znprdx> wrote: [snip] The immediate Rh3 looks winning. > The key to the White win is that the White Rs get busy faster than their Black counterparts, and indeed, Toga rates 17.Rh3 at about +1 P. <<> This position is too one-sided to merit serious consideration [snip] > The dialectic of the position requires a complete mastery of two-edged swordmanship: I found its serious consideration quite rewarding, as it displays Spassky's brinkmanship brilliantly. |
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Nov-16-08
 | | chrisowen: School's out on this one. Plugged it in my hard wired brian and strangely enough got first four moves. 14.h4 is neat, gee it must have given kicks. |
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| Nov-16-08 | | Eyal: <johnlspouge: Toga gives the following best play variation after 18…Kxg7 19.Qf6+ <Kg8> 20.Rh3 (threatening 21.Rf1 22.Qxf7+ 23.Qf6+ 24.Rg3#) 20…Qd8 21.Rg3+ Kf8 22.Qh6+ Ke7 23.Rg7 Qf8
Black is toast because 24.Nxd5 will open the d-file.> As pointed out by <tallinn>, 23...Qd7 makes things a bit more tricky for White in this line, though instead of 24.Ne4 as suggested in his analysis more simple is 24.Qg5+ first, and only after 24...Ke8 25.Ne4! e.g. 25...Bxe4 26.Rg8+ Bf8 27.Rxf8+ Kxf8 28.Rxd7 (Rxc2+ 29.Kd1 Rf2 30.Qe3), or 25...Qe7 26.Nf6+ Kd8 27.Rxd5+! exd5 28.Rg8+ Kc7 29.Nxd5+ and Nxe7. |
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| Nov-16-08 | | johnlspouge: < Eyal: <johnlspouge: [snip] As pointed out by <tallinn>, 23...Qd7 makes things a bit more tricky for White in this line > Hi, <Eyal>. I missed <tallinn>'s analysis. Eventually Toga agrees with everything you point out, although it required a lot of backsliding to find <tallinn>'s perpetual check. Thanks. |
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Nov-16-08
 | | MichaelJHuman: What if black refuses to take the offer of the bishop? |
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Nov-16-08
 | | Once: My friends, I have learned many painful lessons in chess. Never underestimated 10 year old boys or incontinent dodderers. Don't start day-dreaming about seven of nine until the game is over. Oh, and be very wary about dissing a CG sunday puzzle. My first thought was that we have another tweazy puzzle. 17. Bf6 cries out to played. Then whatever black plays he is stuffed. 17...g6 allows 18. Qh6. 17. gf allows Qg4 or Qg5 followed by ef. But the real trick here is to spot the reason for 17...Rfc8. At first, this seems like a pass move, but it also allows the sneaky defence Bf8. Now g7 is defended and white's slow play of queen to the g file doesn't blast through as we hoped. Slot the position after 17...Rfc8 into Fritz 11. At first, Herr Doktor thinks the game is equal or at best a slight advantage to white. He is looking at moves like 18. Qg4 = 0.00. Then quite a few seconds in, he spots 18. Bxg7. The advantage rises to +0.4, then +0.9 then +1.7 then over 2. Here is a sample line, out of many: 18. Bxg7 Kxg7 19. Qf6+ Kg8 20. Rh3 Qd8 21. Rg3+ Kf8 22. Qh6+
Ke7 23. Rg7 Qf8 24. Qf6+ Ke8 25. Nxd5 exd5 26. e6
In the final analysis, I think white does win. The position is certainly not tweazy if Fritz does not spot it straight away. To get the full point today, you need to see the Bf8 defence and the follow-up for white starting with Bxg7. Rh3 seems to be an adequate alternative to e6. None of which I saw, of course. <rodantero: you wrong noted the variation from this move on> We generally cut each other a lot of slack here about minor details like that. As long as we all know what we mean it doesn't really matter if we make the odd slip. |
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| Nov-16-08 | | stacase: Got the first move, but I would have played: 18 Qg5 |
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| Nov-16-08 | | johnlspouge: < <Once> wrote: My friends, I have learned many painful lessons in chess. [snip] Oh, and be very wary about dissing a CG sunday puzzle.
My first thought was that we have another tweazy puzzle. > Hi, <Once>. After acceptance 17.Bf6 gxf6
of the sacrifice, either 18.exf6 or 18.Qg4+ lets Black Kg8 run for cover at h8, leaving White down about 2 Ps, according to Toga. You might have learned not to diss a CG sunday puzzle, but I suspect many solvers thought acceptance of the sacrifice easy to refute. It's not, because even with Toga, I found only 18.Rh3 to refute it. Maybe some higher priced software can prove me wrong... |
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| Nov-16-08 | | johnlspouge: By the way, <Once>, here's a Rorschach test for you. 
click for larger viewWhat do you see? |
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| Nov-16-08 | | Open Defence: I see a puppy! |
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Nov-16-08
| | Once: <johnlspouge> Now that's a weird one! My first thought was that we have an illegal position - wot no kings? How did those pawns get past each other? The black b8 pawn has materialised from nowehere and the a8 and c8 white pawns ought to be queens by now. The chessic part of my meagre brain objects to an impossible position. Then I see a white cross - a giant X stretching from a8 to c6 and a6 to c8. If this was Indiana Jones or Dan Brown, the treasure would be buried at b7. But then the artistic side of me starts to doodle in all that empty space. Forget the pawns having a party in the Northwest and look at the vast expanse of desert they have left behind. Or maybe there are a couple of kings camouflaged down in the f and h files. What do you think, doc? Am I nuts? Will I ever be able to play the piano again? |
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| Nov-16-08 | | Woody Wood Pusher: I saw 17.Bf6 quite quickly, but only because it is a puzzle position. |
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| Nov-16-08 | | johnlspouge: < <Once> wrote: <johnlspouge> Now that's a weird one! [snip] What do you think, doc? Am I nuts? Will I ever be able to play the piano again? > Hi, <Once>. You know, you really <are> a good sport. You passed my Rorschach and appear to be a reasonably healthy, not totally obsessed individual. It's seven of nine :)
Unfortunately, <OpenDefence> appears to have real problems ;>) |
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Nov-16-08
 | | Jimfromprovidence: Does it make a difference if black plays 16…exd5 instead of 16…Bxd5.?For example, after 16 <exd5 >, say 17 Bf6 Rfe8.
click for larger view
Now, if 18 Bxg7 Kxg7 19 Qf6+ Kg8 20 Rh3 Qd8 21 Rg3+ Kf8, then what?
click for larger view |
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| Nov-16-08 | | Eyal: <Jimfromprovidence: Does it make a difference if black plays 16…exd5 instead of 16…Bxd5.?For example, after 16 <exd5>, say 17 Bf6 Rfe8. Now, if 18 Bxg7 Kxg7 19 Qf6+ Kg8 20 Rh3 Qd8 21 Rg3+ Kf8
click for larger viewthen what?>
22.Qh6+ Ke7 23.Ne4!
click for larger viewfollowed by Nf6 after the bishop retreats (or, in case of 23...dxe4, 24.Qf6+ Kf8 25.Rxd8 Raxd8 26.e6!) and White seems to have a crushing initiative here as well. |
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Nov-16-08
 | | agb2002: The black castle is not well defended. A possibility to open lines against the black king is 17.Bf6 (threatening 18.Qg5 g6 19.Qh6): A) 17... gxf6 18.Rh3 (threatening 19.Rg3+ Kh8 20.Qxf6 mate) A.1) 18... f5 19.Qg5+ Kh8 20.Qf6+ Kg8 21.Rg3 mate.
A.2) 18... Rfc8 19.Qh6 Bf2 (19... Bf8 20.Rg3+ Kh8 21.Qf6+) 20.exf6 winning. A.3) 18... Be3+ 19.Rxe3 is bad for Black.
A.4) 18... h6 19.Qxh6 doesn’t save Black.
B) 17... Rfc8 18.Bxg7 (threatening 19.Qg5+)
B.1) 18... Kxg7 19.Qf6+ Kf8 20.Rxd5 exd5 21.e6 Qc7 22.Rf1 B.1.a) 22... d4 23.e7+ Kg8 24.Qxf7+ Kh8 25.e8=Q+ Rxe8 26.Qxc7 dxc3 27.Qxc5 winning. B.1.b) 22... Ke8 23.Qh8+ Ke7 24.Rxf7+ Kd6 (24... Kxe6 25.Qf6 mate) 25.Nb5+ Kc6 27.Rxc7+ winning. B.1.c) 22... Be3+ 23.Kb1 doesn’t look like an improvement for Black. B.2) 18... Bf8 19.Bf6 h6 20.Rh3 followed by Rg3 and Qg4. B.3) 18... Be3+ 19.Qxe3 Kxg7 20.Qg5+ Kf8 (20... Kh8 21.Qf6+ Kg8 22.Rh3) 21.Qh6+ Ke8 22.Nxd5 exd5 23.e6 and the black king is too exposed. I think I’ll stop here. Time to post and check.
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Nov-16-08
| | Jimfromprovidence: <Eyal> <22.Qh6+ Ke7 23.Ne4! followed by Nf6 after the bishop retreats (or, in case of 23...dxe4, 24.Qf6+ Kf8 25.Rxd8 Raxd8 26.e6!) and White seems to have a crushing initiative here as well.> 23 Ne4 does looks pretty good. If 23...Bb6, then 24 Nf6. If 24...d4, then 25 Rg7 looks strong. 
click for larger view Even better for white might be 24 Rf1, threatening Rxf7+. 
click for larger view Now, after 24...Rf8, 25 Nd6 looks like a killer.
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| Nov-16-08 | | Marmot PFL: That was a beautiful game. Once the attack starts there is not much black can do different. Boris was no lame duck after the Fischer match. |
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| Nov-16-08 | | whiteshark: I'll try to solve this (17th?) tomorrow in a monday morning mood. |
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| Nov-16-08 | | njchess: I managed to solve this puzzle through move 26. Qxe8+. Mate soon followed. I also had a line with Black playing 19. ... Kg8. It lead to a probably winning material advantage for White. I can't really blame Black for choosing f8 since it must have felt like choosing between the lesser of two evils. As an aside, Black's position begins to fall apart with 14. ... Bc5 followed by 15. ... Nd5?. The net effect of both moves was, after the knight is exchanged, to remove the defenders of the key f6 square which White can now occupy with support. Nd5 is usually played by Black when there is no White bishop on c4 for that reason. Nd7 is better and leaves the position unclear. Also, White gets away with less than accurate play with 14. h4!? The immediate Qf4 or Bxf6 are both playable, although I can understand why White doesn't want to play Bxf6 since he desires exf6. Fortunately for Spassky, Black could find no advantage. Which brings me to my final point. As <znprdx> implied, Valeri Korensky had an ELO of approximately 2394 and Spassky's was probably around 2600 at the time of this game; not exactly evenly matched. A better example of a similar game between more evenly matched opponents can be found at Bronstein vs Averbakh, 1963 . |
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| Nov-16-08 | | futonchild: man korensky just wouldn't die
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Nov-17-08
 | | kevin86: White could have paid the ultimate punishment for greed if he played: 28 ♕xd7??? ♗e3+ 29 ♖d2 ♕a1# would REALLY turn the tables. |
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| Nov-19-08 | | patzer2: For the Sunday Nov 16, 2008 puzzle solution, Spassky plays 17. Bf6!! to initiate a deep demolition of pawn structure combination for the win. Here's a breakout:
<17. Bf6!! Rfc8>
If 17... gxf6, then White wins after 18. Rh3! Rfd8 (18... Bf2 19. Qxf2 f5 20. Nxd5 exd5 21. Qxf5 Qb6 22. Rxd5 Qh6+ 23. Kb1 Qe6 24. Rg3+ Kh8 25. Rf3  ) 19. Qh6 Be4 20. Nxe4 Rxd1+ 21. Kxd1 Rd8+ 22. Ke2 Kh8 23. Nxc5 Qxc5 24. Qxf6+ Kg8 25. Rg3+ Kf8 26. Qxd8# <18. Bxg7 Kxg7 19. Qf6+ Kf8> If 19...Kg8, then White wins after 20. Rh3 Qd8 21. Rg3+ Kf8 22. Qh6+ Ke7 23. Rg7 Qf8 24. Nxd5+ exd5 25. Qf6+
Ke8 26. e6 Rc7 27. Rxh7 Re7 28. exf7+ Rxf7 29. Qg6 Rd8 30. Re1+ Be7 31. Rf1 Rd6 32. Qxf7+ Qxf7 33. Rfxf7 Bxh4 34. Rfg7 Kf8 35. Rxb7 Bg5+ 36. Kd1 Bf6 37. Rb8+ Rd8 38. Rh8+ Bxh8 39. Rxd8+ . <20. Rhf1 Rc7 21. Nxd5 exd5 22. e6 Qxa2 23. e7+ Kg8 24. Qxf7+ Kh8 25. e8=Q+ Rxe8 26. Qxe8+ Kg7 27. Qe5+ Kg8 28. Qg5+> 1-0 Black resigns in lieu of 28...Kh8 29. Qd8+ Kg7 30. Qxc7+ . |
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Kibitzing
sac: 18.Bxg7
icon.