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Robert James Fischer vs Lhamsuren Myagmarsuren
"A Tangled Web We Weave" (game of the day Jul-06-2021)
Sousse Interzonal (1967), Sousse TUN, rd 3, Oct-15
Formation: King's Indian Attack (A07)  ·  1-0

ANALYSIS [x]

FEN COPIED

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Robert James Fischer vs Lhamsuren Myagmarsuren (1967) A Tangled Web We Weave
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Kibitzer's Corner
< Earlier Kibitzing  · PAGE 14 OF 14 ·  Later Kibitzing>
Jun-28-20  hez: 17.Nf1 is another brilliant subtle move knowing very well the importance of the Knight to d2 then e4.
Nov-08-20  Helios727: Is this the game where Fischer busted up laughing at a bad move by Black in the post game analysis with the other American GM's? If so, which was the move he laughed at? It was supposedly a game against a Mongolian player.
Nov-09-20
Premium Chessgames Member
  perfidious: Only time I recall reading of such an episode regarding Fischer, whose manners at the board were considered impeccable, in distinct contrast to his shenanigans away from it, was in his celebrated win over Geller at Palma 1970. Geller proposed an early draw and Fischer, as the account went, laughed at him in response.
Nov-09-20  SChesshevsky: <Is this the game where Fischer busted up laughing at a bad move by Black in the post game analysis....?>

Don't know. But heard Fischer once laughed in a junior tournament when his opponent played an unusual opening. Think Fischer was very young and can't remember what opponent played. Maybe Bishops Opening? But turns out opening was rare but playable.

Thought here A. Mongolian played a good game. Seems very logical and I didn't see any howlers. Though when you have to play 23...Qe8 and 24...g6 to try to save the king, it's probably pretty bad.

Much of the time in post game analysis the most fun is trying to blow up other kibitzers suggestions. Can see as more likely Fischer gleefully deriding outsider analysis rather than an opponents pretty good game that was lost because he got outplayed at the end. But guess with Fischer anything is possible.

Nov-09-20  Helios727: It was Seirawan who told the story on Youtube. He said it was against a Mongolian opponent. Did Fischer ever have another Mongolian opponent? Seirawan said it was in Fischer's hotel room after the game with Robert Byrne and other American GM's. He said Byrne and the other GM's were stressing in their minds to figure out what Fischer was laughing at so as not to look dumb. They did manage to figure it out.
Nov-09-20  Petrosianic: I've heard more than once that he laughed when Addison played the Center Counter Defense against him. But I didn't hear it from any reliable source, just one of those internet things.
Nov-09-20  Granny O Doul: It's a bit different to laugh once you're in your hotel room. I'd say it indicates admirable restraint.

Re: Schesshevsky, Fischer recalled once nearly laughing out loud when an opponent played the Wilkes-Barre (he must have been pretty young at the time). He didn't laugh when his opponent reached a winning position, though Fischer pulled it out finally. I don't know if the score of this game exists anywhere.

Ujtumen was another Mongolian player Fischer once faced, but it's unlikely he laughed during that game: Ujtumen vs Fischer, 1970 .

Nov-09-20  SChesshevsky: <Helios727: It was Seirawan who told the story in YouTube...>

Thanks for the YouTube direction. Hunted down the video and here's my take.

Seems Seirawan heard the story from Byrne. Byrne stresses Fischer breaking up over a move made. I'm guessing it was more that Fischer found calling his opponent "a pizza" unbelievably hilarious.

I've never heard "a pizza" as a derogatory term for a poor chess player. So I'm assuming it was meant as somehow personally insulting.

Think Byrne, and plenty of others, gave/give Fischer a pass on a lot of things because of his chess brilliance. But think there's plenty of evidence Fischer was likely a jerk through his whole life.

I certainly don't see a move here that would have, as the story is told, Fischer nearly rolling on the floor. But if my take is wrong and Fischer wasn't just being an insulting jerk and there was some hilarious move (...g6 or ...Qf8?), I apologize to both Fischer and Byrne.

Nov-09-20  Granny O Doul: I guess "pizza" is just a pun on "patzer". It is not a very impressive pun, as pizza has no connection I can see to his opponent or anything else of relevance. Now if he had called him a "boortsog", that I might get behind.
Nov-09-20  SChesshevsky: <Granny O Doul: I guess "pizza" is just a pun on "patzer"...>

That's true. Maybe Fischer meant to call him "patzer" and said "pizza" by mistake. It is kind of funny.

If that's the case I'd have to apologize to Fischer for my previous assumption but maybe not Byrne.

Nov-10-20  SChesshevsky: <Helios727> Thinking about the A. Mongolian game, I seemed to remember it was a Dragon Sicilian. So I looked it up in Soltis book "Fischer Revisited" and he says it was the 1962 Olympiad game with Purevzhav.

Makes sense related to Byrne's story about Fischer having a suite with the other Americans coming to visit. Also maybe makes calling him "pizza" based on his name more reasonable. And there was a unsound N sac that finished that game. Can see how Fischer would've found the name and move combination funny.

Nov-10-20  W Westerlund: This game, and all else Fischer ever did, is of course proof of his divineness according to people like harrylime, but black's highest rating ever was 2390, not exactly hard competition for a top grandmaster.
Nov-10-20
Premium Chessgames Member
  HeMateMe: But, a 1960s 2390 was about 2600 in today's inflated numbers? Not a serious threat to a super GM (bobby Fischer, Magnus Carlsen) but no one to fall asleep on either...
Jul-05-21  thegoldenband: So, will this be the GOTD on July 6?
Jul-06-21  Brenin: A classic KIA, with 13 a3 a key move.
Jul-06-21
Premium Chessgames Member
  Bishoprick: Fisher was not unbeatable. He had a minus score against Tal, and this when Tal was no longer in his prime.
Jul-06-21
Premium Chessgames Member
  An Englishman: Good Evening: Regarding the question of how often Fischer faced a Mongolian player, he did face another one at the Palma Interzonal. If Fischer laughed at this gentleman, he might have regretted, for he did not defeat the much weaker player. Ujtumen vs Fischer, 1970
Jul-06-21
Premium Chessgames Member
  fabelhaft: <Fisher was not unbeatable. He had a minus score against Tal, and this when Tal was no longer in his prime>

Well, Tal won the games they played in 1959 and none after that. But Fischer did in general have problems with top Soviets, 3-5 against Geller, 0-5 against Spassky up until game 3 of their match, even against Korchnoi etc. Even if I guess everyone had problems with the top Soviets.

Now one can see that Fischer was another player in 1971 than a few years earlier. At the time even an American chess magazine could write that the new Elo rating system was weird, having Fischer as shared first with Spassky in 1967 even though Fischer scored bad results against the best players, and should be ranked behind Spassky.

Then after his results in 1970-72 Fischer became better also the decade before those results. But he was good enough in the 60s anyway, of course.

Jul-06-21  Viking707: While Fischer certainly had his problems with paranoia, he was right about Soviet chess, and the fear that when he played against a USSR gm, he was playing against a team, and not just the person. His one game with Botvinnik proved the point, as they sealed their moves before retiring for the night, and while Fischer slept alone, Botvinnik's team saved him from defeat, and enabled him to pull out a draw the next day.
Jul-06-21
Premium Chessgames Member
  perfidious: Tal enjoyed a meteoric run from 1957 to 1960; when <was> his 'prime'? Before this? The above statement is ludicrous.
Jul-06-21  Petrosianic: <Viking707>: <...the fear that when he played against a USSR gm, he was playing against a team, and not just the person. His one game with Botvinnik proved the point,>

Er... you do know that his game with Botvinnik was played in a <team> event, right? The fact that the team played as a team should not be any great revelation.

<...while Fischer slept alone, Botvinnik's team saved him from defeat, and enabled him to pull out a draw the next day.>

Er... you do know that the use of seconds performing adjournment analysis had been common practice since the 1930's, right? I don't know if Fischer had a second at Varna, but he definitely had one at Curacao, and now you say that's unethical? You just called Fischer a cheat. Whose side are you on??

You also know (or maybe you don't), that Botvinnik didn't save the game through superior adjournment analysis, but because Fischer blundered away the win with 51...b5?

Jul-07-21  Petrosianic: <SChesshevsky>: <Don't know. But heard Fischer once laughed in a junior tournament when his opponent played an unusual opening.>

I've heard that Fischer laughed when Addison played the Center Counter Defense against him in the interzonal. But you can never tell. So many Fischer stories are nonsense.

But I think Fischer himself admitted to <almost> laughing, or wanting to laugh when someone played the Wilkes-Barre Variation against him, before he looked closer and realized that it was actually trappier than it appeared at first glance.

Jul-07-21
Premium Chessgames Member
  keypusher: According to Tal, both teams spent the night analyzing the ending, though apparently Fischer preferred to work alone. Of course, Botvinnik had much better teammates than Fischer did.
Jul-07-21  Petrosianic: I'd be very surprised if they didn't. They'd have to be crazy not to analyze any adjourned positions they didn't regard as either hopeless or completely in the bag.

Viking's claim that Fischer slept rather than use a second or even bother to analyze the position himself is a totally made up claim.

Oct-18-21
Premium Chessgames Member
  WTHarvey: This is a gif of the queen sac 'mate in 3' position in the game:

http://wtharvey.com/fisc6.gif

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