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< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 3 OF 3 ·
Later Kibitzing> |
| Jun-22-08 | | TrueBlue: of course, the objective of the position was to move the black bishop! White has a lot of opportunities, but the damn bishop has to move. There are two ways to do that Qg4 and h5. I first considered h5, then Qg4, wasted too much time to see that Qg4 doesn't work, which leaves h5! Here we go. h5, Bxh5, Rf6, gxf6 and the rest is history. Very nice puzzle! |
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| Jun-22-08 | | jdc2: Great problem as far as winning a pawn.
Does anyone have a concrete analysis of the endgame after the last move by White (Bg4)? My Fritz 6 can't figure it out! |
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| Jun-22-08 | | pferd: 
click for larger viewIt could go something like this:
1... Ke7 2. Bh5 Bd5 3. g6 Kf6 4. g7 Bg8 5. Bd1 Ke7 6. Kg6 Bf7+ 7. Kh7
Kf6 8. Bc2 Ke7 9. Kh8 Kf6 10. Bh7 Ke7 11. Bg8
Once the White Bishop reaches g8 and evicts the Black Bishop from the a2-g8 diagonal, it is game over. Centurini worked out the theory of this ending in the 1850's. It is not a slam-dunk however - White must play accurately. For example after 1...Ke7 a natural looking move like 2.Kg7 allows 2...Ke8 and White can no longer win. |
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Jun-22-08
 | | Jimfromprovidence: After sleeping on it (literally) , I'm now convinced black will draw with 50…Ke7?! After playing the position several times, when the board reaches six pieces, the result is a table base draw every time, no matter white does on move 51. In the text position, black’s bishop cannot impede the advance of the g pawn. This is true in part because the white king is perfectly placed to escort the g pawn to the end of the board, so if the bishops are exchanged, which black has to avoid, the white pawn can easily promote. Black’s king is also out of position, and cannot get over to help stop the advance of the g pawn. After 50…Ke7, the position is completely different. Black’s bishop and king are both in position to halt the advance of the g pawn, specifically at g6. |
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| Jun-22-08 | | goodevans: I think that most kibitzers seem to be missing a couple of important points. First that 31 … Bxh5 isn’t forced. Black has a viable alternative in 31 … Be8. Second that 31 ... Be8 may even be black’s best move since 31 … Bxh5 32 Qh4 Qb6 33 c5 seems to win pretty quickly for white. Perhaps I’m wrong and it’s me that’s missed something (?). |
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| Jun-22-08 | | Jesspatrick: 35...♕f8 allowing the exchange of ♕'s was perhaps not as good a try as 35...♔g7 36.♕d4+ ♔g8 37.♗d5+ ♗f7 38.♕g4+ ♔f8 39.♕f3. The black b pawn will fall, but Queens stay on the board for a while. Harder to win than the game, I think. |
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| Jun-22-08 | | Marmot PFL: <Jimfromprovidence:> I think that you are right that 50 ...Ke7 draws. Black still has to play very exactly and be ready to give up his bishop for stalemate in positions with Kf8 and Bf7. |
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| Jun-22-08 | | slapwa: goodevans: 31. ..., Be8 32. Rf6 is like the game less a pawn. |
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| Jun-22-08 | | TrueBlue: <goodevans>, you are right, Be8 is a very good move and a move I considered. However, it doesn't save black. |
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| Jun-22-08 | | goodevans: <slapwa: goodevans: 31. ..., Be8 32. Rf6 is like the game less a pawn.> Yes, but at least it doesn't give white the option to win with (31 ... Bxh5) 32 Qh4. |
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| Jun-22-08 | | whiteshark: I't really interesting to note the difference between the lines <50...h5 51.Kh6 Kc7  > 
click for larger view and <50...Ke7 51.Bd7 h5=> 
click for larger view |
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| Jun-22-08 | | crwynn: I didn't see this rf6 at all though it's not a complicated move, I didn't bother looking because I missed ...Be8! where Rf6 is necessary to get a clear win, I didn't see that rf8 is still impossible. The line with qh4 and meeting ...Qb6 with c5 is much simpler and stronger than the game, finding that one was no problem (and of course h5 is a really obvious move). I wonder if Bilek missed it because of the way he arrived at h5: he saw Rf6, came up with a way to make it work (deflect the bg6) and didn't bother to look for a "cheapo" hitting h5 and d8. Maybe time trouble was a factor too. |
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| Jun-22-08 | | jovack: saw the earlier tactics, but thought it would turn out a draw still |
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| Jun-22-08 | | 234: Saturday puzzle <19. ?> Jun-21-08 Christiansen vs DeFirmian, 1985 |
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| Jun-22-08 | | Gouki: whats wrong with 20...♕xc5? |
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| Jun-22-08 | | patzer2: For today's Sunday puzzle, the pseudo sacrifice 31. h5!! forces the win of a pawn with advantage. However, if play through White's 50th is forced, then, as <Jimfromprovidence> indicates, 50...Ke7! = appears to hold the draw. P.S. Also instructive is the not 31. Rb2?? possibility, which allows 31...Rxd5!  to remove the guard and win a decisive piece. |
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| Jun-22-08 | | TrueBlue: And how come there is Hungarian opening and no Bulgarian opening !?!??!?!!??! |
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| Jun-22-08 | | TrueBlue: and there is an English opening !?!?!? |
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| Jun-23-08 | | TrueBlue: England or Hungary don't have a single world chess champion, but they have openings named after them !?!?!? It's a conspiracy I tell you, a conspiracy! |
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| Jun-23-08 | | lebourdonant: Hi all, this is my first post, I enjoy reading and learning from the posts I see.
Great web site. Great team.
On move 50 after proposed drawing move 50...ke7 ?
the following winning line for white (?!) is to be considered. 50...ke7 ?
51 c7!... Bg4, 52 Bc6 Kd6 (h5!? 53 Bf3!) 53 Bf3! black Bishop moves and h6 (or H5) falls…
51 ...Bc7,52 Bc6 ! Black bishop moves and h6 falls..
I guess we should seek same color bishop ending with advantage in playing and hard to defend. |
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| Jun-23-08 | | pferd: <lebourdonant: On move 50 after proposed drawing move 50...ke7 ?
the following winning line for white (?!) is to be considered. 50...ke7 ?
51 c7!... Bg4, 52 Bc6 Kd6 (h5!? 53 Bf3!) 53 Bf3! black Bishop moves and h6 (or H5) falls� 51 ...Bc7,52 Bc6 ! Black bishop moves and h6 falls..> You seem to be suggesting the line 50...Ke7 51.c7 Bg4 52.Bc6 Kd6 53.Bf3 B moves 54.Kxh5 Kxc7 but the resulting position is a draw no matter where the Bishop moves along the h3-c8 diagonal on move 53. |
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| Jun-23-08 | | lebourdonant: Dear pferd,
I am not sitting with a prog here, so yes I can be wrong, hence the (?!) after winning.What I thing after black bishop move (say d7) , on move 53 is:
54. K*h6 l*c7 55. Kg7 Kd6 56. Kf6 Bc8 57. Be4 Bd7 58. Bf5
So until here all is not forced, but:
white can get the f6 square, from which he can control interference on f5 with his Bishop and subsequently run the G pawn
after 58… Bb5 59 g4 then
a: 59... Be2 60. g5 Bh5 61 Bg6 Bg4 62 Bf7
b: 59…Bc4 60 B g6 (with the intention Bf7… )
The black king is useless if being cut off and so it seems one line remains if the black king moves to the back rank.
so 55.Kg7 kd8 56. Kf6 (f7??) Ke8 57. Bd5
and doing the interference on e6 feels like it.
If I miss it, enlighten me!
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| Jun-23-08 | | pferd: <lebourdonant: Dear pferd,
I am not sitting with a prog here, so yes I can be wrong, hence the (?!) after winning.What I thing after black bishop move (say d7) , on move 53 is: 54. Kxh6 Kxc7 55. Kg7 Kd6 56. Kf6 Bc8 57. Be4 Bd7 58. Bf5 So until here all is not forced, but ...> Yes. After 58.Bf5 White wins in that line. But 57...Bd7 was not the correct move. Play 57...Bg4 and draw with correct play. And you are quite right that this information comes from a computer database - I'm not sufficiently strong to work this out on my own. |
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Jun-23-08
 | | Once: <TrueBlue> There are actually two English openings, or rather one opening and one defence. The English opening is 1. c4 for white and the English defence is 1. c4 b6 or 1. d4 e6 2. c4 b6 for black. Even stranger, there is no American opening. Unless you count the Cambridge Springs ... |
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| Jun-23-08 | | lebourdonant: Thanks Pferd! |
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< Earlier Kibitzing · PAGE 3 OF 3 ·
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Kibitzing
sac: 32.Rf6